Thrifty Vac

robert.c.brown15

Hello All,

Sorry if I seem to be spamming the boards. I don't intend to. I did just find out some really great information I wanted to share.

Some of you may know about the Thrifty Vac kickstarter - http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/1066541019/thriftyvac/posts?page=1

It looks like a great vacuum sealing product but yesterday I contacted him about whether or not his product can compress fruits and vegetables much like an expensive chamber vacuum sealer. He told me it could, but I was still skeptical because I can't believe it would be powerful enough so I sent him a Youtube video showing the process. He said that yes, it definitely can do that, and once he has finished more of the Kickstarter orders he said he'd make a video showing the process.

As someone who will never, ever, ever be spending the money on a chamber vacuum sealer, this could be quite the product I am looking for. And because I wouldn't compress fruits and vegetables every single day, this product could be perfect as I can store it in a drawer when I'm not using it.

Anyway, wanted to pass this along for those interested/never thought they could work with compressed fruits and vegetables since chamber vacuum sealers are so expensive.

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Comments

DiggingDogFarm_65362

No way!

With a hand pump?

I have a vacuum hand pump that's heavier-duty than what he's using, it's made for a vacuum tumbler, and there's absolutely no way that it'll pull an effective vacuum for compression.

Get a faucet aspirator as I've done, you can compress with that.

Another thing about sealing stuff in regular zip bags, they're not intended to hold a vacuum, even the fancier Zip-Loc heavy-duty freezer bags can't be trusted to hold a vacuum for an extended period of time, sometimes they do and sometimes they don't.

~Martin

robert.c.brown15

This was his initial reply:

Hi Robert,

Yes, ThriftyVac will compress fruits, and anything else placed inside the food bag.

Watermelon would produce quite a bit of fluid, which would flow into

the outer gallon-size bag. You then would have to rinse out the

gallon-size bag, or replace it with a new one, when you wish to vacuum

pack some other food material.

Regards,

Tom Cannon

This was his reply after I showed him a youtube video of the process:

Hi Robert,

I might have time to create a video after we satisfy our Kickstarter commitments.

ThriftyVac will work the same as the vacuuming unit shown in the

YouTube video, only quicker. The key is to leave enough space between

the watermelon cubes to create a state of hydrostatic pressure (uniform

pressure in all three dimensions) so that the water remains inside the

cube, thereby intensifying the flavor per unit volume.

Regards,

Tom Cannon

This is the video I sent him - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lRK3qAtz1IM

Once you compress a fruit or vegetable, it doesn't matter anymore if the vacuum holds since you are taking it out of the bag right? For sous vide, I've only used the water displacement method and haven't had a bag fail me yet.

The Youtube video doesn't seem to be working but if you search compressed watermelon, it the first video.

Johan_Edstrom_5586

Skeptical.

DiggingDogFarm_65362

He's talking about a different form of compression in my opinion - squeezing - that's not what's happening in a vacuum chamber where adequate vacuum is pulled and tissue vacuoles rupture.

~Martin

Brandon_34695

It might be worth re-reading the chefsteps introduction to vacuum compression, because I think the video is misrepresenting why this works in a chamber sealer. The bag pressing down on the food isn't a major factor to the final texture, it has more to do with the rapid change in pressure. There is no change in pressure using the Kickstarter hand pump, only a reduction in air and some "compression" due to the bag pressing down. Not the same thing!

Johan_Edstrom_5586

The compression of the bag ruptures surface, that is still true, but air is removed and usually

during really good compression liquid is removed due to boiling.

This technique requires a chamber-style vacuum sealer. During the vacuum sealing cycle, the surrounding pressure falls to the point where water within the plant tissue begins to boil, and it's the expanding water vapor that does most of the work of rupturing structures within the plant tissue. The lower the pressure goes, and the longer the vacuum cycle, the greater the damage and, thus, the better the final effect.

Edge-style vacuum sealers don't reduce surrounding atmospheric pressure. Thus, structures are never ruptured inside the plant tissue, and compression cannot happen.

The flexible packaging is essential too. Once the vacuum cycle is complete, air must not be allowed back into the ruptured plant tissue, otherwise it won't collapse. A sous vide bag provides a flexible skin that keeps air out, but allows the weight of the atmosphere to press down on the damaged plant tissue so that it collapses.

DiggingDogFarm_65362

http://www.chefsteps.com/courses/accelerated-sous-vide-cooking-course/vacuum-compression-of-plant-foods

DiggingDogFarm_65362

"The flexible packaging is essential too. Once the vacuum cycle is complete, air must not be allowed back into the ruptured plant tissue, otherwise it won't collapse. A sous vide bag provides a flexible skin that keeps air out, but allows the weight of the atmosphere to press down on the damaged plant tissue so that it collapses."

Yet I'm able to compress just fine with the faucet aspirator and without flexible packaging.

???

Johan_Edstrom_5586

"Compression" in a vacuum chamber with no bag doesn't really do anything for the final effect.

lfmichaud

The bag is not needed. I got almost the same effect simply by putting the melon pieces in a bowl with the liquid I wanted to infuse. Also you can get enough vacuum with a handpump it's just not as practical.

http://www.cookingissues.com/2009/06/02/vacuum-infusion-for-the-home-cook/

DiggingDogFarm_65362

@Johan Edstrom

"Compression" in a vacuum chamber with no bag doesn't really do anything for the final effect.

What do you mean by that?

~Martin

Johan_Edstrom_5586

The last "color" change and hardening isn't really getting there without the bag.

You can infuse and compress without it, but that last cool color change is definitely helped by the bag.

DiggingDogFarm_65362

I compress, release the vacuum to rupture the vacuoles and then put it back under vacuum and hold it for a bit....that seems to work great.

Isn't that essentially the same thing that's happening in a chamber sealer and a bag?

~Martin

Johan_Edstrom_5586

Probably

Johan_Edstrom_5586

This color change -

DiggingDogFarm_65362

The problem with trying to pull a strong vacuum with a hand pump and the like within a bag (and this applies to channel bags as well) is that there comes a certain point where the bag closes off the vacuum, that happens far in advance of vacuum adequate enough to compress (bust vacuoles.)

I've tried it with numerous bags, even the channeled FoodSaver bags and the like. The same thing happens when using the vacuum aspirator, the bag closes off limiting vacuum.

Now, I suppose it's possible to do it in a small jar with a converted hand tire pump or one of those hand brake bleeder pumps, but I can't see that happening reliably with a cheap plastic pump like the one in question.

Johan_Edstrom_5586

I'm thinking you'd have pretty oversized underarms if you manage to handpump and hold a vacuum for 50 secs.

robert.c.brown15

I guess I'll definitely be looking out for a video from him. I'm sure though that you can't possibly get the same results with the hand pump. Regardless though, that Thrifty Vac seems pretty great and stores very easily. Might have to look into it a little later anyway.

robert.c.brown15

@DiggingDogFarm, can you share your home set-up for compressing fruits and vegetables? This is something I may be interested without having to spend so much on a chamber vacuum sealer.

Can others share their cheap at-home methods of achieving compressed fruits and vegetables?

"The

flexible packaging is essential too. Once the vacuum cycle is complete,

air must not be allowed back into the ruptured plant tissue, otherwise

it won't collapse. A sous vide bag provides a flexible skin that keeps

air out, but allows the weight of the atmosphere to press down on the

damaged plant tissue so that it collapses."

Yet I'm able to compress just fine with the faucet aspirator and without flexible packaging.

???

- See more at: http://forum.chefsteps.com/discussion/1215/thrifty-vac#latest

"The

flexible packaging is essential too. Once the vacuum cycle is complete,

air must not be allowed back into the ruptured plant tissue, otherwise

it won't collapse. A sous vide bag provides a flexible skin that keeps

air out, but allows the weight of the atmosphere to press down on the

damaged plant tissue so that it collapses."

Yet I'm able to compress just fine with the faucet aspirator and without flexible packaging.

???

- See more at: http://forum.chefsteps.com/discussion/1215/thrifty-vac#latest

DiggingDogFarm_65362

I've been very busy trying to sell some real estate, but I'll try to get some pics and a post together soon.

For small stuff you can use a cream whipper......

http://www.cookingissues.com/2013/08/03/new-technique-pressure-pickle-and-the-cucumber-martini/

robert.c.brown15

Thanks, looking forward to it! That is an interesting method on that site. Don't have an iSi whipper so I'm having trouble picturing it.

DiggingDogFarm_65362

@Robert,

You can read a little bit about it in this thread......

http://forum.chefsteps.com/discussion/360/vacuum-compression-of-plant-foods/p1

~Martin