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Foie Gras

tuckatodd

I haven't seen much discussion on here about SV foie yet. I have a nice 1 lb lobe in my freezer and have been wanting to cook it in my circulator. I'll open this up to any thoughts or suggestions. Thanks!!

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Dennis_Cloutier_38122

You have to wonder which marketing genius came up with "Chilean Seabass". I mean, don't you think "Patagonian Toothfish" sounds much more awesome? I mean, which would you rather eat?

seijoed

I'm still going to feel good about my frozen lobster from Costco because that is the best I could find here on short notice for our date night.

I sincerely agree that life is X Rated, I wish more people understood that, especially when it comes to kids, interactions and over protective behavior.

Tim_Sutherland_52834

@Matthew Snyder, you can tell people until you are blue in the face and they can agree that the lump of flesh in front of them was once a living breathing animal, but until you see, hear and smell a creature (the cuter the better) being killed so you can eat, you will take food for granted. Read Thomas Keller's account, The Importance of Rabbits, in The French Laundry Cookbook (p205) to see the impact of killing a rabbit had on him as a young chef. Michael Psilakis writes a moving account is his cookbook How to Roast a Lamb, (pp138-141) describing the slaughter of a lamb for Easter when he was a young child and how this has shaped him as a chef. With more time I'm sure I could find other examples.

I believe that day one of any culinary program the students are shown a rabbit and it is explained how you care for it. Each day the student interacts with the rabbit (feeding, cleaning the hutch etc) to form a bond. After a month the students have to kill and dress their rabbit. They then cook a basic meal with the animal and eat it. This would make them much better chefs in regards to respecting their product and reducing waste. Making every high school student do it as a requirement for graduation would do no harm either.

The problem with allowing "people that don't particularly want to do that" to opt out of seeing an animal dieing so they can eat, is the people that need to see it, will not. Life is X rated, not the PG13 sanitised version that most of us live in. We need to remember the X rated side so that we can be better people and better cooks. While people say they know meat was once alive, our supermarkets are filled with white rectangular slabs "wrapped in plastic". It must be fish as it is sold in the fish section - the marketers wouldn't lie to us would they? I'm still looking for Patagonian Toothfish at the fishmongers but they say they can't get it. I find that substituting Chilean Seabass works well.

I have been lucky enough to travel to many countries in this world. As much as possible, my wife and I like to visit food markets and grocery stores. We do this for twofold reasons, one we are both interested in food (what is actually sold) and two, we are both interested in the food economics (product price point, product size and packaging, shelving display and placement, processed vs fresh vs frozen, size of store, etc) (My wife has an agricultural economics degree and works as a corporate banker to agricultural businesses; I have a number of finance degrees). One of the main things I notice is, as a general rule, in many other parts of the world flavour and freshness trump price. You would not consider buying a headless fish, as by looking at the head you can quickly tell if the fish is fresh or not. If the head has been removed it must be because the fish is old. You know your chicken is fresh because you pointed out which live bird you wanted 30 seconds ago.

Cooking and eating should be emotional experiences. I'm sure it is no coincidence that food/cooking/religion are so entwined. Even as an atheist, there is a religious feeling when I have a doe in my rifle sites. I know with a few pounds of pressure with my right index finger I will end the life of an animal. I have an obligation to the deer and to myself to kill the animal cleanly and to harvest as much meat as I can. I know when I cook the flesh I will do so with care. Unfortunately I know many cooks/chefs that do not take the same care, because to them meat is a red tube that comes in a cryovac bag, occasionally with bone attached.

matthew.snyder77

@Tim Sutherland, I heartily agree with everything you said there..... except this bit: "Watch an animal be slaughtered then eat some of it's flesh. If you can't do this, then don't be a hypocrite and eat meat." While I personally have been to a slaughterhouse and seen it with my own eyes, I don't think people that don't particularly want to do that should be branded hypocrites. That would be like making people observe an open heart surgery before they could get a valve replaced.

So long as people know that meat came from a living breathing animal, and not from a factory already packaged on a piece of Styrofoam, then that is sufficient in my book. Lots of people labored for long hours to make sure their animals were fed and looked after properly, that they were slaughtered humanely, and that they were butchered in a sanitary way with care and precision.

As we've become a more urban nation, we've seen the complete divorcing of the bulk of our population from the means of food production. People don't care about the conditions of chicken farms, they just care that McNuggets are like $0.75 a piece. As you allude, they think a cow is made up of tenderloin, strip, ribeye and hooves.

Read a bit, people.

seijoed

I promoted that - well said @Tim, it is something we've been slowly moving towards over the years, I'll admit that we are not good enough at it, we certainly look for cheaper cuts and eat much less on each plate we have.

I have as this years project to really work on my butchering skills...

Tim_Sutherland_52834

I have been to a few Hudson Valley presentations about foie and their operations are top notch. Their ducks are very well treated and they employed Temple Grandin's company to ensure the animals live and are killed in the best conditions available.

The handlers look after a small number of ducks during the force feeding period. The handlers are paid a bonus for the number of Grade A (the highest grade) livers that come from their ducks. Until you have seen a duck cut open and the foie gras pulled out you do not realise how much of the cavity of the bird is filled with the liver. As a side note male ducks are used for foie as the ovaries of the females get entwined with the liver, which means the liver is more likely to be a Grade C. The liver is easily bruised as it is so big, so the birds are very gently handled.

Hudson Valley Foie Gras welcome tours of their operation, they are a very open company. No I am not endorsed by them, but for full disclosure I buy duck fat (by the gallon) from them.

(Steps onto soapbox)

If you want to see animals not treated well, visit a 100,000 feedlot. It is an eyeopener and nose closer. Even with the very best operations, having a large number of animals in a small area and finishing them on grains can cause problems. Compounding the fact is the American consumer is very price conscious and they want very cheap protein and only a limited range of cuts. This means the workers in the abattoirs and packing houses are low paid and these positions are not always valued. By comparison go to Brazil and see the meat workers there. They are well looked after and it is seen as a noble career.

As a consumer, either buying for your family or for a restaurant, demand the best product available. (Note local is not always the best, efficiency of scale, competitive advantage, amongst other things need to be considered, I wont go there as this is another very tall soapbox). Try different cuts of meat. The slaughter weight of a cow is over 1,300lbs - eat more than the 6lb tenderloin. Understanding the techniques of Sous Vide cooking will help you here as you can prepare these so called lesser cuts into very tasty meals.

As you seek to improve your cooking skills, read and explore where your food comes from. Study animal husbandry and gardening. Visit farms. Talk to those that grow and raise your food. Watch an animal be slaughtered then eat some of it's flesh. If you can't do this, then don't be a hypocrite and eat meat.

Think about your food trimmings and waste as you prepare you food. Can they be used for another dish? Don't throw money away.

Think about the cycle of food. Most people believe food is grown, harvested, prepared, cooked and then eaten - that's it end of story, WRONG. Food goes in one end of you and eventually comes out the other. Think about how this waste is treated and handled. Why are there so many cities in first world nations that have sewage issues after heavy rain. Raw human sewage, or any sewage, should not be allowed to pollute living or food production areas.

(steps off many soapboxes before frustration sets in and things are thrown about the room.)

Shannon_Barnes_68642

oh, I do agree with you about those that think we should all be vegan pushing their beliefs on the rest of us...

I didn't know that about the ducks and geese raised for foie gras, thank you so much for posting that! I hadn't researched it myself, and I have no experience with it, only what I've seen in the news. Now I won't feel guilty next time I have the opportunity to eat foie gras!

matthew.snyder77

I'm going to disagree with you there at least in part, Shannon. I don't think that ducks and geese raised for foie are mistreated at all. In fact, they are probably more cared for and looked after and - dare I say it - pampered than 95% of animals raised for food. They sort of have to be cared for this way, as any stress that might come about from the type of rearing typical for poultry can lead to a terrible final product. The ducks spend the final two weeks of their lives being force fed in a way that mimics (as close as is practical) the natural behavior of the birds fattening themselves for winter where it is not uncommon for them to swallow whole fish.

Generally speaking, it has been my experience that the loudest complaints about foie come from people who prefer that no one ate animals at all. Foie is just an easy target because it's a luxury item, and it involves force feeding.

But I don't want to derail the thread further, so I'll leave it at that.

Shannon_Barnes_68642

Another unhappy Californian, the ban is ridiculous given that so many other animals are equally mistreated... Why don't they do something about the torturing of pigs and cows at the slaughter houses? I love foie gras, and would so love to eat it again.

seijoed

I don't have an ounce of respect for either tool.

Brendan_Lee_56950

ounce for ounce which one is worse for you foie or coca cola?

seijoed

It is great that we have so many elected people that help us with our diet!

matthew.snyder77

Giving it away is not as common here in CA as it was in Chicago during that city's short-lived ban. There were around 400 restaurants that had it on their menu prior to the ban coming into effect on July 1, and not too many of them have tried skirting the law. The law doesn't expressly say giving it away in a restaurant is legal, but it's pretty pretty transparent when you are serving a $20+ brioche appetizer with 'complimentary' foie two ways. And restaurants aren't too keen on testing the limits of the $1,000 per violation per day penalty.

(In other words, if I understand the regulation, if you serve 30 orders of that appie over a three-day period, the fine would either be $30,000 or $90,000)

Brendan_Lee_56950

$40 beans and plum reduction with a free side of foie! BOOM!

Jack_Mayer_85396

I read where some chefs/restaurants in CA are "giving the foie away" rather than "selling" it to get around a really stupid law!

matthew.snyder77

I can drive to an adjacent foie-friendly state and purchase the product there and drive it back across state lines and cook it in my kitchen. But I can't produce or sell it.

No one in Sacto cares about the conditions of the chickens being raised to end up as McNuggets, but the Gonzalez family has to stop making fattened duck livers.

*sigh*

Jack_Mayer_85396

@Matthew - what a bummer! Also, for those who may be interested, D'Artagnan (www.dartagnan.com) has free shipping on orders of at least $100 through Thursday. I'm trying to get my order together ...

@Grant, thanks for the info. I've eaten torchon and loved it, but never made it. I tend to go for the seared version.

matthew.snyder77

I live in California. No foie for me. :-(

tuckatodd

Thanks Grant!! I will try this. If you have time, check out my post of chamber sealers. I am really undecided at this point. Thanks again!!!

grant

Depends on what you are looking for, serving hot or cold? I almost always prefer cold cured foie that is never cooked with heat. Don't soak it in milk or water like they say traditionally, this does nothing positive for you end product. I also use this method for cured marrow.

100% foie cleaned foie

1.75% salt

.25% insta-cure #1

1.25% sugar

.5% sweet spice or four spice

Clean foie with desired technique

Sprinkle all powders

Roll into a torchon and vacuum pack for a week.

Eat cold, warm or purée with butter or a mousse.

For cooking a foie, vacuum pack the whole foie when it is very firm and cold. Cook at 65c for 1 hour. Slice, sear, blowtorch, chill for later. But I usually do enjoy or serve hot foie grad. Although there should bot be much, remember to keep any rendered fat.

tuckatodd

I would really love some feedback from Chris or Grant. The site is so great and informative and look forward to the future of it. Thanks again!!!