New version of Joule circulator

montebello1964

Apparently there's a new Joule "Turbo" circulator on the horizon. Someone on Reddit ran across some images on Breville's website, but they are now password protected.

https://www.reddit.com/r/sousvide/comments/12xq8g5/new_joule_turbo_was_browsing_the_breville_site/

It's been several years since we beta tested the "Turbo" steak algorithm that Dough Baldwin came up with. Maybe this is packaging a new app with this capability and the Joule Steel? Or is it something different?

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Comments

whenric

Unrelated question (btw this looks cool). I mostly use this (janky) forum, listen to cooking issues, and sometimes peruse pizzamaking.com. Are there other forums that you like for good food discourse? I haven’t really enjoyed the official chefsteps FB group.

montebello1964

I gave up on the two Facebook groups for Joule, too much beginner stuff and inconsistent moderation, which are problems with a lot of groups. So I created my own r/CombiSteamOvenCooking (>5000 followers) on Reddit, which is very polite because I insist upon it. Still a lot of beginner stuff, but I created it more for combi oven evangelism purposes anyway. For general food discourse, I don't really follow anything. PizzaMaking.com is cool, but now that I've worked out my standard pizza recipe for my Breville, I don't really visit it much anymore. Cooking Issues is great, but I just don't have the patience for podcasts. Big fan of ChefSteps recipes, so I visit here a lot.

montebello1964

Well, the Turbo is here:

https://www.chefsteps.com/joule-turbo

Discount of $75 if you already own a Joule.

Other than the software, I can't see that there is any difference from the old Steel version (which hasn't been for sale for quite a while). Some of the pictures make it look taller and thinner (and the water spout is a different shape), but it's hard to tell if that is true since the listed dimensions for the older versions don't make any sense and are clearly incorrect.

So the difference from the White is that the app has added functions (and the steel components, which make no difference anyway)? The marketing strategy behind this is puzzling. Perhaps the Steel wasn't selling well relative to the White (which was predictable), so this is a way to still charge more for the Steel and justify it with the software difference.

montebello1964

Video:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RLDn9I3M9DU

They were smart to turn off comments! Trying to explain physics tends to set off the average Internet commentator.

montebello1964

If you were involved in the beta-testing, check your email and they will send you one for free!

Brandon_Byrd_40557

This seems more like a software update than a new circulator, even if it has some new capabilities. I thought if they did a revision of the hardware they might have done the dirty deed and added a small screen and some physical controls. But I suppose this does take a lot of the mystery and thought (and timing worries) out of cooking SV with a temperature delta. I'm sure there were many technical hurdles to bring the algorithms to bear on our cooking times, so I'm really happy that Doug Baldwin (and company) were able to get the math to work for us. That's a real achievement. I remember the good old days when we had to use Baldwin's tables to look things up for slabs or cylinders, and then eventually the the SV Dash / Polyscience app. Fast forward a decade and we have some really smart circulators around. I wonder if Breville will add Turbo to the Hydropro.

montebello1964

From one of CS's comments on Facebook, it seems to have new hardware too, but I'm not clear on what or why. These Joules are a lot more complicated than people think (it already adjusts based on your altitude, which I'm sure most people don't realize). I've always been surprised that they haven't played up their technology differences from Anova. For example that the heating technology is completely different and much more efficient (which is why it heats so fast).

It is also unclear if the size has changed. In the pictures, it looks taller and thinner, which implies a hardware difference (my two Joules are definitely shorter than what they list for the Turbo). But the listed dimensions online are clearly incorrect for the old Joules (they are not 4 inches wide lol), so I'm not sure how to compare them to the Turbo. The exit port seems to be a different shape too (at least that will make it easy to tell the new from the old).

whenric

Thanks and agree with your thoughts. Could you share your standard pizza recipe for Breville?

Just so I can contribute something of value, I’ve taught my dog to find Oregon black truffles in the woods, and it’s really fun! We sometimes will find up to a pound. Here’s her digging, and a truffle pie (fantastic!)

montebello1964

That's easy, I use exactly the recipe from Seattle's "The Independent" that was presented in several articles on ChefSteps (search in the recipe page)! Makes a nice "Neapolitanish" pizza in the Breville, usually 700°F deck/750°F dome x 2 min, although sometimes I do 750/750. Best results with 4-5 hr RT bulk ferment + ~44hr cold ferment of 230g balls. 60-63% hydration, depending on time of year and batch of flour (usually King Arthur bread flour).

I just got the flours from the recent CS pizza class, but haven't tried that recipe yet.

BTW, years ago, when Oregon truffles were first getting some press, I hired one of the top truffle dogs to do a hunt and then had the black and white truffles shipped to Philly for a private dinner at Blackfish (at the time the top-rated restaurant in Philly, and still my fav). Maybe not as good truffles as the famous ones, but in the hands of a great chef it was one of the best meals of my life.

I want a truffle dog too!

whenric

I know details are scarce here. But I can't imagine why this can't be achieved JUST via a software upgrade. I have enough Joules already and don't need to buy more. I hope (even if I have to pay for the feature) that I can use my OG Joules for this too!

montebello1964

If I understand correctly, it is also a different app (the same as the one for the Joule oven). They will have to eventually transfer the old Joules to the new app, but they don't work with it now. (according to the mod of the FB group who seems well connected).

I don't know if there is unique hardware involved (they seem to say there is). But the concept of a "line extension" is common in business. Microsoft didn't get to be Microsoft or Apple to be Apple by making it easy for you to avoid upgrading.

willhjonathan

The only physical difference they appear to be advertising is the height growth from 11.0 inches to 12.28 inches. Both are listed at 1.85 inches in diameter. They still advertise 1100 Watts and 10 gallon capacity, which surprised me. Buying the Turbo gets you a free ruler though.

I'm really against this new Turbo method to begin with, but I'm going to be especially frustrated if the two Joules I bought are rendered useless. A Turbo FAQ page says "Will my original Joule Sous Vide work with the latest app? Currently, you can’t pair your original Joule to the new app. We are assessing if this will be possible in the future and will announce any future updates via email and the original app." Does anyone know what constitutes "new" and "original" here? I regretfully updated my Android app to version 2.75.0 before reading that. My iPhone app says 2.74.4. Will I need to freeze version or find a way to roll back?

I get that subscriptions are the new, easier way to turn a profit, that everyone's jealous of Apple's planned obsolescence strategy, and I do want ChefSteps to remain profitable enough to stick around. But if they brick my Joules it's going to leave a real lousy taste in my mouth. My Smart Oven and Control Freak were even more expensive...I can't imagine ever buying another product from this brand if they institute a policy like this.

whenric

There already IS a new app available (I downloaded it last night), called "Breville Joule". The turbo stuff is only steak. And (IMHO) the app is a confusing mess. Lots of outside content, recipes that at first glance look like they are for SV but are actually for the oven. Much more like the new oven app (I don't have the oven so I suppose I can't say how it functions in practice).

Look, obviously Breville can do whatever they want to do. But hopefully they won't hide a new feature behind software if the old model can physically do the task. I'd even be willing to pay to unlock this new feature!

mconcannon

Hi Will, the original Joule app will continue to be supported and function exactly the same as it currently does, so you will still be able to use all of your Joules without any changes. That said, we are looking into the possibility of moving everyone over to the new Joule app and we will share more news when we have some!

mconcannon

Hi Wes! All of the content will be available once a Turbo Joule is paired, so anything you are seeing on the Breville Joule app without pairing a Turbo is just a preview! The oven content is the same, only a small portion is available before pairing a Joule Oven.

mconcannon

Hi! Joule Turbo is about 31 cm long and 4.5 cm wide. The original Joule is about 28 cm long and 4.5 cm wide. These were unofficial measurements at my desk, but should be fairly accurate! Hope that helps.

montebello1964

Do you really think anyone is going to brick your Joules? Since you don't seem interested in Turbo, you should probably just stop worrying about it, since there's zero chance it will affect you.

I look forward to getting my Turbo next week. Then I can run 3 Joules in one bath at the same time. Imagine how fast that will heat up!

Dana_Lacoste_569125

My turbo was delivered today and.... I am a bit disappointed.

Not with the turbo hardware: I was going to pick up a second joule anyways, so may as well get the new model (and the $75 off made it the same price anyways). I have been using the joule for many, many years now (and use it at least 1-2x/week).

No, I am disappointed with the apps.

First:

I want CS to remain profitable so they don't disappear because this site works well for how I cook. If that means shifting over to more content and letting Breville handle the HW/SW, that is not objectionable.
I understand that Breville is in the middle of centralizing some functions, so it is not unreasonable to expect some things to get Breville-ized: I have other Breville appliances so that is not objectionable either.
UI changes are gonna upset people, so I am going to ignore that (sure, maybe I like the old app better but...I will refrain from yelling at people to get off of my lawn)

So the issues:

1. I cannot use one app to control both the old and new joule. Now I have two apps installed with the same icon (but different name) that control different devices. This sucks. To be clear: the new app won't see my old joule and the old app won't see the new one.

2. I need to login with my Breville ID (not my chef steps ID) to the app. This implies I will never be able to control the old model because it is connected to CS not Breville.

3. The recipe interface is frustrating in the new app. Specifically, I can't find recipes in the new app that show up in the old app. Specific example: the 20 hour tri-tip recipe is freakin' awesome and I buy several and prep them and freeze them so I can pull it out and have the perfect tri-tip but.... I can't do that in the new app because the recipe ain't there.

This really needed a clear, documented, transition plan. If this "isn't done yet" and needs some work, that is fine, but please tell us what is going on!

whenric

Does it seem to be the same hardware? Have they upgraded something?

montebello1964

They've said (here or on Facebook, I forget--actually I see Megan said something below about this) that the new Turbo works with the Breville Joule smart oven app, not the old app. The old Joules will eventually be moved to new app too.

Makes sense to consolidate into one app, and it needs to handle 3 different types of devices (and maybe more in the future), so this is all understandable. If Breville is going to be a leader in the smart kitchen revolution, I'm sure they are thinking about all this. [By the way, join my new Reddit group: r/Smart_Kitchen]

Consolidating into one ID/password would be good too, but we all know these things are more complicated that they sound. Decisions made years ago sometime make it impossible to get there from here lol.

Hopefully the new app isn't a downgrade from the old app, but it is the future, so we will have to get used to it. I don't have an oven, so I haven't tried it.

Hopefully, you'll be able to run multiple new and old circulators and ovens at the same time. We still can't even run multiple Anova ovens on one app (Anova apps are the worst).

montebello1964

It would make sense that if they want to continue two pricing tiers, that the more expensive one has more differentiation than just a couple of stainless parts. The original differentiation between the White and the Steel wasn't well thought out. I always told people just to buy the cheaper one!

montebello1964

They updated several recipes here this week, and I'm assuming that had something to do with the Turbo, although it wasn't clear to me how it was.

Agree a bit more communication with the regulars would be good. We are the evangelists that will be posting our reactions all over the Internet. Although ChefSteps is tiny, and I'm sure overworked, and Breville is big and corporate, so that may be too much to hope for lol.

chadxp

So, the Turbo peak water temperature is 198 degrees Fahrenheit. The older one could go to 208 degrees Fahrenheit for the Sous Vide Risotto, will there be an update?

mark.slezak

Curious if the "turbo" is incorporating the software PolyScience used to sell as "Sous Vide Toolbox" (aka the old Sous Vide Dash app) into the Joule with more refinements from Dr. Baldwin.

If that's the case, I'm not really sure why firmware push to the current Joules would not allow for the same experience.

I'm certain Breville knows how to run a business better than I do, but I wish there were details on why the current models cannot support the same cooking effect via firmware push. The HydroPro's offer the Sous Vide Toolbox built in to their device that seems to offer similar functionality where cooking speeds can be modified based on dimensions of what is getting cooked and if fresh or frozen but it also is 1450W (to the Joule Turbo's 1100W).

magwills

Where is the "gram" scale? On the new Joule App you are using American Standard measurements! What happen?

Are you going to bring it back?

chadxp

I changed mine under settings, preferences. Does not work on all recipes.

Kyl_Haselbauer_worked_at_chefsteps_1040170

It will always work on any recipe that comes from ChefSteps. But the other contributors and Breville recipes might not.