Go to the Article: Equilibrium Brining
Firstly, thank you! Secondly, to introduce phosphates into the brine I would, presumably, keep the same target concentration, e.g. 2%, and replace some of the chlorides with phosphates, correct? And if so, what would be the recommended ratio of chlorides to phosphates?
I tried brining some chickenbreast for 24h to 0,85%, but I wasn't super pleased about the result. The texture was not what I would call juicy, rather.. maybe "soggy"? Like biting an apple is juicy. Dipping a piece of cake in tea is soggy. Not nescessarily bad. just not the kind of juiciness I'm looking for in meat. I feel the meat breaks down too much and falls apart. (Which is great for things like pulled pork btw)
I keep wondering if I'm doing something wrong, because everybody praises the juiciness of brined meat. Am I using too little salt? Am I brining it for too long or maybe too short? Are there any additional steps I need to take? Am I using the wrong kind of salt (I use tablesalt with iodine)? Is chicken unsuited for brining and should I only use for example pork? Did I maybe sous vide it too long afterwards (I think I gave it 1½ hour)?
For comparison my default goto when preparing chicken breast is 1) fry quickly. 2) Sous vide 1 hour at 62.5C with spices but without salt. 3) Cool down. 4) Salt and wait 10-15 minutes. 5) Fry again at high heat until brown and crisp on the outside. This gives the deep rich umami juciness I'm looking for. Crisp and salty on the outside. Tender and juicy on the inside.
This may simply be a matter of preference, and simply disagreeing with me may be a perfectly valid answer. But if I'm doing something wrong please correct me, so I can join the club of happy briners.
I really would love Chefsteps to research the impact of the differences you are stating. How can some salts contain sugar? I'm more concerned with the cost side. Table salt is so much cheaper than kosher. So, I would lean towards to using that for brines but if you are saying that it does affect taste, I would tread differently. I hope someone with true scientific knowledge can provide some advice.
i dont try yet,, but i tried the brining on pork belly fat-duck style.. its to salty for the result,, i tried reduce the time also still salty,, then i plan to use EQ brine.. what is the solution to make the prok belly bring enough, cut the time during brining????
Maybe your STUDIO PASS should explain it to you
Hello Mario, to add MSG to the brine you will still follow all the same ratios. Just replace part of the salt amount with MSG. Of course if you were to 'add' MSG to above formula it will boost the umami and round out the salt. Adding .25-.5% to the amount of salt would be my suggestion.
Can MSG be added to this type of brining? If so, what would the percentage be?
Hi Milton, there would be no change to the recipe for injecting. Just do your injections and give it the same amount of time to equilibrate. This method is about the time to evenly distribute the salts. But if you are looking for a quicker brine check out our other activity on Brining Poultry. https://www.chefsteps.com/activities/brining-poultry
Can anyone answer me?
I also add some herbs and spices to my brine how do i convert my brine to inject it in a whole chicken? Please reply i am a studio pass member
The quality of the salt you use in any cooking, from starting a ferment to finishing grilled foods, is absolutely important. Some salts contain sugar, various agents to prevent it from caking, or iodine and other chemicals. Table salt, the most common thing you'll find in you local grocery store, is quite unsuitable for most purposes. Unrefined sea salt, pickling salt, and kosher salt all have different properties that suit specific purposes. Be aware. In ancient Rome, Centurions and common soldiers were paid in salt; hence the word "salary". It is essential stuff, even today. The staff of life, in fact. Pay attention to the salt you buy and don't use inferior products, unless you prefer inferior results! Brining, the subject here, is more forgiving than other cooking processes, but even then, the better your salt, the better your result. Salt is a whole world unto itself, especially when we equate it with producing tasty, nutritious foods. Without salt, we'd all be dead, so live it up and use good salt, not an ersatz substitute.
what about dry brining? (I'm also thinking about your roast chicken). Like weigh the meat only and use that portion of salt rubbed evenly onto exterior?
That is incredibly cool! Thank you!
Thank you!
I was debating trying that Heston Blumenthal recipe on YouTube and you just made it a sure thing.
Bravo and thank you!!
Amazing mate! Cheers^^
I wrote a simple java calculator for equilibrium or gradient brining. It also estimates time. Give it a try. http://www.genuineideas.com/ArticlesIndex/saltbrinecalculator.html
That is kinda the opposite of the purpose of this method.
The idea is to only use as much as needed in the end result, so you don't have to concern yourself with timing, and you get a perfectly even brine. If you are short on time, this may not be the method for you.
Doesn't mention anywhere how long to brine in order to complete this technique ...
Can I braise a large beef knuckle roast in the same (equilibrium) brine that I diffused it in?
What are you using to keep the food submerged under the brine. Is there a better method than just using a ziplock bag filled with water.
Also, if using a chamber vacuum sealer speeds up the pickling process, is the same technique applicable to brining chicken (or other proteins)? I've looked around various forums and have yet to find any substantial information.
Thanks again!
Will using a higher concentration of salt speed up the time it takes to brine? Or will it just make it more salty?
Thanks.
Totally loving this website with all the scientific perspective to cooking.
I think the confusion here is Brian is speaking of a PORK tenderloin and not a beef tenderloin
This is rather vague on how long to brine.
I use 1.5 % for two to four hours.
How much salt for chicken wings? And how long to bring?
I get great results when I brine a tenderloin. It comes out significantly more juicy than if just cooked as is and let to rest. Not only that, but, in the video at the top, ChefSteps are equilibrium brining a tenderloin (39 seconds into the video it displays at the bottom of the screen).
A large cut like what? What a chamber style vacuum sealer does will compress the liquid around the outside of the food. this will rapidly infuse flavors (like a marinade) below the surface, but, just like traditional marinading, it will only penetrate so far: tests have shown that marinades only penetrate about 3.2 mm below the surface. Because salt is a much smaller molecule, and through the process of osmosis, it will penetrate much deeper, but to really speed up the penetration, you would need to expose the both the meat and brine to tremendous pressures (well over 100 psi, and there are still debates about how effective this is) or via injection, which is when you mechanically inject the brine into the muscle tissue using a syringe or a high pressure fluid jet.
What a chamber style vacuum sealer does will compress the liquid around the outside of the food. this will rapidly infuse flavors (like a marinade) below the surface, but, just like traditional marinading, it will only penetrate so far: tests have shown that marinades only penetrate about 3.2 mm below the surface. Because salt is a much smaller molecule, and through the process of osmosis, it will penetrate much deeper, but to really speed up the penetration, you would need to expose the both the meat and brine to tremendous pressures (well over 100 psi, and there are still debates about how effective this is) or via injection, which is when you mechanically inject the brine into the muscle tissue using a syringe or a high pressure fluid jet.
It won't, unless you leave it in there so long that it starts to spoil.
Everything you need to calculate what you need is in the descriptions above.
You've got it switched up - great for ham, not really suited for a tenderloin.
How to compute the brining formula.. please give me an example thanks
Hello! Is there a rough guide of some sort to inform how long to brine a piece of meat/poultry/fish for? I fear leaving the food in the brine for too long will affect its texture.
hello. please tell how long did the pork cook sous vide in the video about brining equilibrium.
How long did you cook it for please?
I see you advise to use sugar for seafood in the fast brine. But why not in the equlibrium brine as well?
Hello everybody, Qick question. Would this brine work for a piece of meat such a whole bone-in ham hock or is it more beneficial for leaner cuts such as a tenderloin?
i have access to a large chamber vac and would like to improve the brine time if possible, but a comment below suggests that it would not. does anyone have experience with the brining stage for a large cut like this? vac with brine? inject with brine then vac? how long with each? (also posted on the smokerless brisket comments) --thx
why wouldn't it speed it up? my understanding is that it would, but i am by no means an expert. especially with a chamber vac.
If the weight of the bone should be subtracted, I looked for a weight for Turkey bone and found an interesting table out of Meat Science and Application. The table shows 17% bone for Turkey but uses live weight. To get to a dressed weight, I suppose you would have to add back in the non-carcass percentage, which the table shows is 18%. So for a 10 lb. dressed turkey, you would add back in the non-carcass weight, which should give you a live weight of 11.8 lb., which means you have 2.00 1lbs. of bone for a net of 8 lbs. of meat. I'm no mathematician, and I've seen rough estimates of a higher ratio of bone to meat, so someone needs to check my methodology.
Vacuum sealing it would not speed things up, just ensure the meat was in constant contact with the brine solution.
Will your brine (before you add raw meat) have a taste similar to your final product? I would assume so because the levels of salinity are equal. (The fate of my Sunday dinner rests on that assumption because I just put it in a brine that tastes like what I want to eat on Sunday)
Hey ChefSteps team! Quick question, I'm thinking of using soy sauce to do an equilibrium brine. I understand that Soy Sauce is roughly 20% sodium so would that mean that I would simply multiply the Soy Sauce (in grams) required by 5 from the amount of salt (in grams) required?
So for example:
For a 4% Salt Brine I'd take "Weight of (Meat + Water) * 0.04 = Weight of Salt required)"
If I wanted to replace the salt with 20% sodium soy then would it essentially be Weight of Salt * 5?
Is it possible to speed up the process of brining by using a vacuum sealer? And if it's possible how (time, amount of brain etc.)?
how much time it has to stay in the bath??
What about a veal tenderloin? Would it take any benefit from equilibrium brine?
and.. http://www.genuineideas.com/ArticlesIndex/brine.html
I found some interesting info on this and it appears you need a whole many days to reach full equilibrium. What are your thoughts. http://www.genuineideas.com/ArticlesIndex/diffusion.html
