Go to the Recipe: Umami-Bomb Vegetarian Demi-Glace
I like that you're eyeballing it and using words like 'about' for the measures. I'm all for precision and weighing things, but I'm also a believer in intuition. And Yeti, I believe in Yetis, too.
Presumably using the PC would reduce the time for the 2nd roast? Or would we sacrifice some of the caramelization flavor (maillard) that would likely happen due to veg not being submerged in the oven?
Ha ha! The host's delivery alone makes you want to make it, just because.
I tried to see the recipe for the Lamb Rack and it was not there.What happened?
D.Sequeira
Modernist cuisine has a fantastic carrot soup that they make by adding a little baking soda to reduce the ph causing more caramelization. Then it's cooked in a pressure cooker. Would that work out here?
On that note...is pectin a percentage of water weight? For those of us using it for the first time, have 0 intuition.
I love this site!!! Thank you Chef Steps for all the hard work and great info!!! My chef at culinary school told me about this site in my very first class and I have been hooked ever since. Keep em coming guys!!!
I'm really not sure what you're asking here. The above measurements are by mass. If you want to change it to percentage, you can do percentage off of any one of the ingredients you like. Typically I use the most mass used ingredient, but for scalling, you'd probably be using baker's percentages, which, again, can be off of whatever you want. Could you clarify a little, or did that help?
all recipes are wonderful! thanks Chef Steps!
Looks soooooooooo tasty! If kept refrigerated, how long could it survive before spoiling?
What is the best long-term storage? Vacuum pack & freeze? Freeze as cubes? Could you process it in jelly jars & make it shelf-stable?
Grant, the seaweed that you get in miso soup is Wakame.
Can I substitute agar for pectin? How would that affect the texture, I assume it would be less smooth, are there any other side effects? Additionally, would substitution 1 gram agar per 10 gram pectin be adequate to start with? Or would you recommend a different substition ratio?
Like should we base the percentage of pectin based on the total mass including vegetables and water or just water? Thanks for the help!
Roasting in regular home convection oven takes MUCH longer to achieve the doneness in video. Mainly, I don't get the addition of dry kombu AND msg. you have mushrooms, tomato paste and if kombu is used properly (glutamate extracted in warm water first) then the msg is unneccessary.
I roasted veg but did stovetop shallot, tomato paste cooked, then deglazed with wine. To the roasted veg I added kombu extraction and a little diluted red miso. Now reducing the near finished product and hunting for the xantham in my pantry. Oh, also added a couple allspice berries and dash of Quatre Epice, squeeze of lemon. Needed some sweet and bright to balance the bitter.
Rock on.
This is a similar technique used in Asian food like Ramen, Chow Fan (fried rice), Chow Mein (chop suey) and others. For the ones that are having issues with this recipe, you'll never achieve that roast point in a standard oven in that time because it can't sustain a specific temperature for a period of time in a stable matter in all areas of the oven.
I live 850 Meters (2,788 ft) over the sea level, that means the boiling point is different, over here I need 330ºC (626ºF) and 4 hours to get that perfect roast, than another 3.5 hours to do the second roast at the same temperature. To finnish up I need about 11 hours to 12 hours.
Yes the taste is AMAZING!
If I may suggest a few changes
Add 210g of asparagus thin sliced or processed.
Remove half of the garlic and add the same amount of garlic chives.
Remove 110g of the Cauliflower.
Instead of 100g of Broccoli add 310
Add 165g of red bell pepper.
Enjoy :-D
Why don't you do the second cooking in pressure cooker? How much time would that take, about 20-30 min? I guess you would not want kombuin PC, how about steeping it in hot water, then using that liquid and veg in PC?
How long will this keep in the fridge? How about the freezer? I'd like to make a big batch and freeze in ice cube trays.
freezing as cubes works for all kinds of liquids. i do this all the time. also, if the liquid has been boiling in the reduce stage, then it would do well in the jelly jars, if they are.. as you say.. processed... (i boil my jars and lids in boiling water for about 5 minutes. only boil the lid inserts for a minute or 2)
Can this be done in a PC, yes it can! But, is just like a good wine, it needs time.
If you take a coffee bean and used to make a filtered coffee or an espresso, the filtered will bring some aspects of that bean and the espresso another very different, witch one do you want?
If you use a PC to prepare this, the taste get a little bitter at the end because you will get the flavor and the roast out of the food, you can use sugar or something sweet to fix it but I don't like it.
I don't know if you have access to this but, try a good Japanese restaurant at your region that serve a dish named Ramen (ラーメン), the broth they use, in general take from 24 hours to 7 days to prepare and is very delicious.
I used this as a basis (stock) for my oxtail stew and OMG did it have amazing base flavour... I skipped the thickening step but reduced it. Added reduced liquid to my browned oxtail meat. Let rest in fridge for 24 hrs then PC for 1.5 hrs, adding leeks and carrots halfway. Meat came clean off the bones.
At least a week since there's no meat, but you can easily freeze in 1 cup portions.
In the process now and it has been in about an hour and it is no where near close. I am thinking it will take atleast an other hour. If it tastes as good as it smells it should be heavenly.
It worked out great it took 2.5 hours at 300°F to get good caramelization, 45 minutes after adding the water and another 35 minutes to reduce by half. It is well worth the time, it is the most umptious demi-glacé. It coats the back of a spoon and has that perfect mouth feel.
You can base it on whatever you want to. Again, bakers percentage are used for scaling, so you can base it off any ingredient you want. Using the mass of more than one ingredient would be foolish, because you would have to pay around with too many variables to get it right in the end. What you want to do to determine the bakers percentages is look at all you ingredients, and pick one to use as 100% . From there, just divide the mass of the other ingredients by that base for your percentage, whatever it is, and that will give you the scaling or bakers percentages.
second this question!
If you try it let us know what happens! Quick google search says some ratios. http://www.modernistcookingmadeeasy.com/info/modernist-ingredients/more/agar-agar#how_add_to_a_liquid
I have made this as well. It takes much long to achieve the right color on the veg. Took about 3.5 hrs @300F in a viking convection oven then an additional 1.5hrs for the second roast. Reduced til i liked the taste (about half). Added 1% Salt, 0.1% Xanthan, 0.75% MSG, 0.5% Pectin by weight to reduced stock, blend and enjoy. This stuff is addicting!!!!!
So I thought I'd give it a try and reading all these comments you guys had great success making this demi. Like many others, the roasting process to get some caramellisation going took longer than expected. But once it looked like in the vid by the chefsteps crew I continued and was pleased as the colour was as intense as in the vid. After the reduction step I tasted it and ... yuk! It tasted like a very very bitter something. Like a vegetable version of cocoa powder in a lot of water. It had no body at all and was not very tasty neither. So I thought about what I did wrong. I thought maybe the roasted garlic gloves turned out very bitter. Or maybe I should've read the instructions more carefully as I reduced the demi on high heat and maybe burned the flavours (even though water can't be more than 100 °C). As you guys can see I don't really know what I did wrong. But maybe you guys can help me?
Used:
144g Celery
61g Kohlrabi
77g Eggplant
62g Raddish
165g Carrots
55g Brussel Sprouts
77g Champignon
89g Onion
2 gloves Garlic
12 g Tomato Paste
12 g Olive oil
Great
You did quite a few things wrong. First, your ingredients.
They didn't use the following ingredients that you have in yours:
Kohlrabi
Radishes
Brussel Sprouts
Champignon
The ingredients you left out/replaced are:
Cauliflower
Celery Root
Beets
Shiitake Mushrooms
Broccoli
Kombu
Salt
Pectin
Next lets talk about your ratios. I have no idea how you came up with masses for the ingredients that were not in the original recipe. Your garlic says "2 [c]loves" with the other ingredients, it really seems like you just randomly decided on amounts to use, and thought it would work. The texture, you never used pectin, which is a thickener, so that would have screwed up your thickness. When you reduce something, follow the directions. Yes, it's true that water doesn't boil over 100°C, however, you're not boiling water. You're boiling water with a bunch of other stuff disolved in it, which greatly increases the temperature which the mixture boils at.
Bottom line, the reason this turned out so bad for you is you just disregarded the bulk of the recipe. Granted, as they say, the recipes are guidelines, but you cannot completely change the ingredients and the ratios of the ingredients to each other, and expect the same results. If you want to achieve what they did, I recommend going back, actually following the recipe they produced, and see if you have better luck.
Overall, works really well. My roast was about 2.5hrs at 400F but it was also 2x the veggies. Let it go for even longer when I added the veg stock (had some) and came up with a really intensely flavored veggie demi. Used it for some grilled branzino with a squeeze of grilled lemon, got it nicely reduced and sauced the fish with just this demi. garlic and lemon. Absolutely delicious.
Tonight, quick pan roast of broccoli florets (think... stir-fry with less oil and looking for some caramelization/ not quite char) and finished the broccoli with thin slices of garlic, Umami-bomb and kept a quick hand at "glazing" the broccoli, so in effect steaming the broccoli while reducing the stock/ bomb. Really worked out DELICIOUSLY.
I've done and do some really good veg stocks to keep around and it's just so... WHY don't you TREAT your VEGGIES LIKE MEAT! And CARAMELIZE THEM!!!
Trust, I'm not a vegetarian but do TRY to eat lighter? This recipe is going to become a REAL go-to for me.
The replacement of your veggies doesn't mean much. Some are more watery than others... Some have different flavor profiles... Some a fresher than others. Somewhere... You weren't paying attention. And I do find that... Maybe the vid... Took the caramelising... Where I would NOT go.
Pan looked very dry and burnt.
I'm cautiously wary of the timing and temp of CS on this one as well. Found that 400F/ 200C works pretty well. You DO need to tend to "your flock" by turning/ redistributing and let it go for a solid 2hrs (check on it at least every 1/2hr). Add your water or veg stock... another good turn... let it go/ reduce... add more water or stock. Do it once more. I found a good 3 reductions/ replenishings worked well, but I DID have a fair amount of veggies.
If kombu is difficult to find... Nori Sheets are a fine substitute. Add them either to the bottom of the pan or later in the process.Same with the tomato paste... I'd add after at least a good 1hr+ has passed.
Raphael... Don't give up here. I didn't follow the recipe "exactly" and still made something really delicious. Made a lot, going to use a lot and have shared this with a few people.
Thanks for your feedback guys.
@J-DuB I will check my local asian supermarket for kombu. Unfortunately I used all my nori sheets for the last sushi feast. @brian I know I didn't follow the recipe exactly and I didn't expect it to taste exactly as the batch the chefsteps crew cooked. Although as they stated in the vid you can pretty much use any veggies you got at hand and since I didn't use any fancy veggies I was just confused about how horrible it tasted. For the 'random' masses, I indeed just randomly shredded some veggies with my mandoline and kept track afterwards how much I shredded in case I want to adjust/keep the recipe. The 'glove' of garlic was a bad yet funny mistake. I had to laugh when I saw your correction. But you are absolutely right. If i want to be 100% sure it will taste awesome I should follow the exact ingrediences and ratios. Thank you for your feedback.
My initial roasting also took way longer than 45 mins to achieve the right texture and colour . I've made lots so a few questions:
Likely life in Fridge? I'm guessing about 2 weeks max
Freezer lots longer... about a month or two?
Once reduced I am thinking it might be better if not serving immediately to add the thickening agents just before serving ie when its reheated - my sense is this will improve longevity and likely deliver a better texture when served.
I'm also intending to smoke half of it and see what a cold butter polish before serving does to flavour and unctuousness
Arrowroot might also work well...
This is an incredible recipe - really tasty worth the trouble - Good way to use up vegetables might have in overflow about to go into compost. Created twice and mine also took about 3 hours first roast at 350, and 1.5 hours second 300F. Kombu makes a difference, but I did not add to vegetables as they roast, I cooked Kombu on low heat in water with Bonito - I made a Dashi broth that adds a real Umami kick.. I used Hondashi soup stock on second batch (can buy Amazon) for Dashi - amazing what it does to flavor makes it a very rich savory liquid.. Can pour this on vegetables or Tofu noodles with few roasted turkey dog about 180 calories total meal, but feels with this demi and taste like 600 calorie feast ....
Not very knowledgeable, but I too am confused about thickeners - the xanthan seemed to work really well here not sure why pectin is also needed ? What does it add ? Seems like dozens of thickener possibilities.. bought a few from www.willpowder.com - but no really good explanation how they work or the differences .. Jason Logsdon's Whipping Siphon book has brief summary, but still lot of mystery.. would love to find out more - I did find two food science books on Amazon but for $600 (!!!) I will wait and fool around on own - does anyone have other good practical thickener guides ?
Awesome! We're so glad to hear it and thanks for being a fan!
Hi Denzil...hmm, odd! Please give this link a try and let us know if you are still having issues: http://bit.ly/1NNJ6gh
If you were making this, how would it do to juice the veg, first? you get all the goodie with little to no loss. You could still put the fiber back into the pan when roasting. then, when you strain, you get ALL the delicious from the veg and can either leave some or all of the fiber in the demi (added back later, if preferred) if you wish to add the original thickness of the veg in the demi.
I just made this. I followed the recipe almost exactly and it turned out, but I'm not blown away with it the way that the folks in the video / other reviewers are. Its earthy and tasty, like really good roasted veggies, but I'm not certain that it was worth the time investment. Could it be all in how you use it? Is there a particular soup or stew that this really brings to life? Any certain recipe you've had success with? So far, I've tried it over pumpkin gnocchi and on its own. An aside: the measurements on this site are a bit of a pain. I've never seen a recipe call for "5 pounds 8.2 oz" of water before ?!!
That is the precision aspect of what Chefsteps offers
Looks amazing. Any recommendations for a substitute for the eggplant, for those who don't tolerate it very well. How about more over everything else?
Hi John, you can absolutely sub other veg for the eggplant. We recommend increasing all the other veg slightly to make up for it.
Soo... last year when this demi was originally posted as "R&D V4", I tried my hand at my own version of it. I added some things, changed some things, and made a post in the forums. "Umami Bomb" was the name I gave to my version... just saying. I know the concept wasn't completely original, but my recipe most certainly is unique (not to mention the name). I love this site, but I'm having a "WTF" moment. https://www.chefsteps.com/forum/posts/umami-bomb-4
If you can't find pectin and xanthm gum, what can you use as substitutes? Would unflavored gelatin work? If so, how much?
Hi Sam, gelatin would definitely work. We omitted gelatin originally to allow this recipe to be entirely vegetarian. Nick recommends adding a few sheets of gelatin to start with, making sure it's fully incorporated and making sure you're testing the viscosity of it at the desired temp for consumption. Add one at a time until you find a consistency you like!
Does this freeze well/
How long will it hold in fridge??
Hi ken!
the pectin adds body and offers a shinier end result where as xanthan exclusively will cloud your sauce. Also xanthan tends to get a little snotty in texture where as pectin really captures the gelatinous collagen rich spirit that gelatin rich demi glaces offer.
I've been using the term "Umami Bomb" for a few years. And when I was talking with my good friend who works as a chef about these techniques (deep roasting, mushrooms, etc...) he mentioned that he'd been using the term for a while too. When a dish in the restaurant was missing a little something but lack of time to refine it, they'd say "Screw it, just umami bomb it." It's a great term!
The recipe was clearly developed using metric measurements. 5 pounds 8.2 oz of water is precisely 2.5 litres.
