Go to the Recipe: Banana Juice
So where does one get Amylase? Also, it appears to me that you are using very ripe bananas and assume that is an important part of the portioning of the Amylase? This recipe looks like it has some great possibilities for sorbet and ice cream but I also wonder about as a base for a winter fruit soup...yum!
You can find Amylase at any brewing supply store. I Prefer to use ripe bananas because you will have a sweeter end product apposed to a under ripe grassy flavor.
How does this compare to the centrifuged juice in terms of yield/flavour?
Ok, now I can see the seives' specs. Thanks.
Its very comparable in color and flavor. The yield is very poor next to a centrifuge but we are trying to develop techniques that can be replicated in your kitchens.
- originally posted by Grant Lee Crilly
I second the idea of sorbet or granita. So, shopping online again thanks to Chefsteps..
I didn't have the sieves, and it seems that these are expensive pieces of gear (#500 runs around $250 on Amazon, or am I looking at the wrong thing?) so I improvised and instead filtered through a paint strainer/filter bag I bought at Home Depot for around $1.50. In any case, I dumped the cooked mixture into the strainer, and got little yield until I utilized Dave Arnold's "massaging the sack" technique, and softly applied pressure. I got about two cups of fairly clear liquid -- and was left with a dry mass of banana starch in the strainer. It made a nice juice which tasted great, but after a few hours in the fridge it set up like a very light gelatin -- did I squeeze too hard? In any case, I added it to some milk, sugar, and lime juice, hit it with an immersion blender, and processed it into a sorbet, and it came out pretty nice.
The extracted pectin caused it to gel, but squeezing too hard wasn't the cause. The pectin is dissolved into the juice, and it's going to come along for the ride. If you want to prevent it from gelling, adding some pectinase to the warm liquid will prevent that.As for the sieves, they can be expensive—although we use ours constantly, so they earn their keep—but you should check affordablesieves.com, sometimes they have them for much less.
Love the flavor of banana but not the texture so am excited to try this! -- But I don't have a water bath (yet) and like to push my Thermomix for culinary play. Since the Thermomix heat settings are either 60C or 70C do you think it will still work? If so, which is best.. to go higher or lower than 65C? -- thanks in advance
I think it will certainly work. Since the temperature control on those is not the most accurate, I would use a set temp of 60C in case its spikes. This way you don't kill the enzyme.
The instructions say to only use agitation when filtering, but the video (to me) shows a scraper used on the finer sieve to increase yield. Perhaps if clarity is not a big issue, then this is permissible?
Perfect, thanks for this link! I think I'll try this with a fine mesh strainer and the triple cheesecloth layer idea first but I'm sure I'll graduate to the sieves because these are likely to be addicting...
Hmmm. 712g peeled banana to start, only 220 g juice. Disappointing yield, but delicious juice.
Man, i'm striking out. I have tried this recipe three times and i'm not getting any separation between juice and pulp. I have all the equipment. Anything i should do to trouble shoot this?
Thinking of trying this out, but not too jazzed about using amylase isolated from fungal culture. Think it might work with a quantity of diastatic barley malt? I know that using the grain will change the flavor, but it may be either really great or a small price to pay...
Any ideas on a non heat treated and clear banana juice? Got some great results with rotavap on centrifuged juices but I don't want to leave the sugars behind with the pectins, so am still working a it.
You will need to heat it. I find the flavor of the heated banana is much more appealing and has more "banana" flavor anyways. If you don't want to heat it, you can add pectin X and centrifuge it. Even a roto vap would heat it a little. Plus you won't get the flavors you are looking for in a roto vap. You will get pure water with a light and odd banana flavor and a reducing syrup.
What is the typical yield using the above recipe? I just made the juice, but my yield did not seem anywhere near to what is shown above.
be very carful with the temperatures and makes sure the enzyme is active. It might be dead. You can test this with an iodine test. before conversion a drop of iodine will turn back if dropped into the banana puree, after conversion it will be purple. Do not add this to your main batch as it will kill the amylase, rather take a small 10ml sample and test that.
it works just the same.
With a centrifuge you will get an 85+% yield with amylase and pectiase enzyme. That is how we would normally do it out kitchen but we are trying to free you guys up from centrifuges. Find another way!
We yield around 325 g. Every banana has a different starch content so every batch will yield a different flavor as well as yield.
You are correct Carol. When the bag of puree is dumped onto the #200 sieve it is never a good idea to place pressure on it. What falls through is a more viscous juice, because of the high pectin content. At that point I place some pressure on it to help it pass through the #500. If you would like the end juice to be thinner, apply the technique for Pectin-Free juice that is on the site to your juice.
sweet. thanks! do you have an idea of how much I start with?
Filtering the banana juice. Thanks for the advice on using pectin enzyme. Worked great.
There are many different amylase types in Germany because of Beer Production. Which one is the right one? Thanks. I think it is time for a worldwide store with all the MDK Ingrediens in one shop. No bullsh.... Anymore with endless long product Research online. I want one distributor with one adress and a fair normal price which delivers every Crazy New Ingredient world wide. The recepi has to be don ein every Country the same way. Here some of the most problematic ingredients. Molecular ingredients, wheat, eggs, Butter, milk, cream, Sea Level....
I dont know why i barely got any liquid extracted from doing this.......any help?
STRIKE 1 - I followed the recipe to a "T" and it did not separate at all! I'm using a Polyscience circulator and it was set at exactly 149 deg. My amylase was delivered this week so I don't believe it would be bad. Any ideas? How ripe do the bananas need to be? or does it matter?
It does not so much separate as the starches break down and it allows for filtering. The liquid is released. Did you try straining?
Lets shoot for % values Nick. It is more helpful access the board. The typical yield might have a range from 30-55% I would say. Nick is correct in saying the ripeness matters. I would also try freezing/thawing then adding amylase and cooking. The bananas might yield even more.
Separate is probably the wrong term to use. It did not thin at all. When I watch the video, yours is thin and moves easily when it comes out of the bath. Mine was about as thick as when I removed it from the food processor. I let it sit on the sieve for 30 min and there was virtually nothing, about 10 drops at best. How long should it be in the food processor? Is there some reaction that starts there to start breaking down the starches or does the reaction start as a matter of heat being applied? Would it hurt for the puree to be in the bath longer than 3 hours? Sorry for all the questions....would a vita-mix create too much heat to make the puree?
Yes a vita-mix could create too much heat, if you go over 65 °C you will start to kill the enzyme. If you don't notice a separation of the solids and juice while its in the bath let it continue to cook. Hope you nail it the next time Keith!
STRIKE 2 - I followed the steps again. This time I held the puree in the bath for almost 6 hours and it turned out the same. Perhaps my bananas are not ripe enough? They aren't green but they certainly weren't as ripe as you use in the video. I've read multiple sites about rapidly ripening them by baking the bananas at 300° for about an hour. Is there any truth that this works and would you consider it acceptable? I'M DETERMINED TO GET THIS RIGHT LOL! Fortunately, bananas are inexpensive, so trial and error isn't a bad thing. I'd just love to get this and make them for Christmas.
Tried this yesterday and like many others, got no separation (the right equipment & active enzyme). Then watched the video (I know, should have done that first) and saw that they puree'd it in the food processor for way longer than I had done. Did it again today and am getting decent results. About 1/2 the yield that they get (I got 175 grams of juice for 6 bananas [770 grams peeled]), but I don't have the fine sieves, so I'm using cheesecloth and don't want to push it through. Anyway, my big lesson (other than to watch the video first) is to puree the bananas a ton, and then puree them some more. Seems like more doesn't really hurt.
- originally posted by Mya-Moe Ukuleles
Good tip, thanks for sharing.
Mya - What was your approximate time in the food processor. I have struck out twice now. I did the same thing on my second run and let it run longer to the point of "hearing a change" while it ran. Much like a sloshing sound. It didn't work for me. I'm thinking my bananas were not ripe enough. I'm determined to get this right LOL!!! I'm not sure there is any truth to this, but from what I've read, more ripe bananas are probably the trick here
Ripe bananas will have a different flavor for sure. More banana flavor. But, the liquid yielded is a result of saccrification. Starch turns to shorter and shorter chains of carbohydrates. You can employ this same method with your oatmeal. Make a gloppy porridge as add some active amylase, it will turn to a thin liquid. Add yeast and you have made beer. Distill that and you have made whisk(e)y.You can use a iodine starch test to check your results before you waste hours. One blended, take a tiny spoon of the liquid, add one drop iodine. If it runs black, there is still starch in the banana and you need more time or you at least know the anylase is not working.If it turns blue purple, you have what is called full conversion. You are ready to strain the rest of the banana that you did not add iodine to.If your yelmild is still poor, it's an issue of overall banana water content or starch content. You can also freeze your bananas, thaw them, then add amylase and proceed as normal for an even higher yield.Grant—Sent from Mailbox for iPhone
Hi,since I can't find any amylase around here in Paris....I was wondering if there's any chance to get the same result with another way or an other enzyme???help I working on some new cocktail for work :-)thanks in advanceDimitry
Diastatic malt powder would work. A brewery supply company should easily be able to provide you this.
FINALLY!!! Success! LOL! I aged my bananas for a few days, froze them and thawed. I also used a bit of the PectinX. I puréed in the food processor for 8 min, then did the sous vide for 3 hours. I poured the liquid through the sieves and then took the remaining "pulp" and let it drain through a chinois (for some extra yield. My starting unpeeled banana was 2025g. My final liquid was 1164g for a 57.5% yield.
Grant. Can you please elaborate on using a centrifuge, in conjunction with amylase and pectiase enzyme? I thought that centrifugal juicers would not work for bananas.
- originally posted by Whit
Yes, using amylae and pectinase enzyme will free up water and sugars form bound starches and pectin that cause a poor yield and trap flavor.
I want to add a little Pectinase I got from the local brew shop to improve yield and clarity. What percentage should I start with? The stuff I got is powdered ...
@grantleecrilly:disqus Which kind of amylase do you use? Gluco or Alpha? I've yet to try the recipe. Just waiting for my Gluco amylase to arrive.
Just got done making this and I should have re-read these posts as I too would have added Pectinase to mix. The amylase I used just says "amylase enzyme formula" so I am assuming it is a mix. I used very ripe banana's and while I juice it was more like jelly with a very low yield. I also checked for starch end conversion, I home-brew also, and it was all converted. Any thoughts?
I've been striking out as well. My amylase is in liquid form. Does this make a difference?
If the liquid amylase hasn't been stored properly (refrigerated) it's possible that it has become non-functional.
You can use malted barley. Here is how to make malted barley if you can't buy it:Step1) Hydrate or "steep" barley. To do this you want to soak the grain in water for 2 hours, dry out for 8 and repeat this up to 3 times. You should see roots sprouting at this point. It happens pretty quick.Step2) Germinate grain by letting rest with free flowing air and a shall layer of grain for about 2-5 days(stir every once and a while to get air to the buried grain) at about [f 65]Step3) Dry malted grain between [f 90]-[f 120].Than grind and use instead of amylase. You will need much more and it will add some flavor but it will be good flavors and very unique for sure.
Excusme, what kind amylase do you use? Alpha or Beta? Thx.
- originally posted by Bernard
Hey there! I'm reading that some people have a problem with the juice gelling. I'm going to try and use this as a base for a cheesecake gel. Is there something i can do to intentionally make it gel? Adding a gelling agent is not a problem, but if i could do it during the process without adding anything it'd be great
Less time with the amylase enzyme will leave more starch, which will tend to result in gelling.
I've followed the recipe using alpha amylase and I seem to have gotten a reaction of a sorts. It is very late and I am going to refrigerate the bag until tomorrow. I hope this won't ruin the batch? According to studies online found via Google a 2 hour treatment at around 40C with pectinase is recommended. I got a mix of pectinase and maltodextrin powder, i hope it will work. Thoughts? :)Some of the steps are unclear. It is not written if alpha amylase is the right thing to use, step 4 says "Vacuum seal juice and reserve until needed." however it doesn't say if refrigeration is an option. I'm guessing refrigeration is OK, but needs reheating to avoid gelling? No time or treatment with pectinase is provided.
Does this work with Mango to get clear mango juice?
yes!
Friends...
I made this recipe yesterday, and although the yield was very low I did get some incredibly delicious crystal clear banana juice in the end. I am writing this because I decided to use some of this juice in a cocktail for me & my lady. The ingredients were banana juice, Ron Zacapa rum, clarified pineapple, and a few dashes of angostura bitters. The ingredients were shaken with a bit of ice and served on the rocks. I noticed something bizarre about the resulting cocktail. Both of our drinks had an amazing fluffy white head that refused to deflate and clung to the sides and bottom of the glass even after the cocktail was finished. I did a bit of research last night to see which of these ingredients could have contributed to the incredibly stable head on this beverage but came up short. Any idea what's going on here? My girlfriend thought I was crazy for obsessing about this but I'm sure most of you would do the same!
Thanks in advance,
Chris
After I make the juice. Can I ferment it to make banana alcohol? Like hard apple cider?
Hi guys,
some questions: I want to follow this procedure as I want to try the banana bonbons, but I don't have some requeried equipment. As home cook want to keep it in a good hobby level and I never have been related to sous vide before, so my doubt is, what would be the difference/advantage using the PolyScience immersion circulator instead of a SousVide Supreme Demi? or can I use also the SousVide Supreme Demi with the same succes?
Does this procedure apply also for other fruits? which ones?
Thanks in advance for ypur help!,
Paul
Whenever pineapple juice is aerated it often leaves a nice stable foam!
Brand is irrelevant. The SousVide Supreme Demi will work just fine.
Oh, wow.
