Go to the Recipe: Fat Duck–Inspired Ultimate Pork Belly
What is the purpose of the water in the bag with the pork belly? Is it necessary?ThanksBrian
A small amount of extra water helps with the hydrolysis of the collagen in the skin, which is a fancy way of saying that you need water and heat together to help convert tough collagen into tender gelatin.
Hi Chris,I'm also curious about the addition of the water in the bag. I've only seen it done in recipes that involve a curing step, like the pastrami in modernist cuisine and the one above. Would non cured meat benefit from this as well, e.g. a little water in the bag with a pork shoulder or a brisket?
Tough cuts, especially those with skin, can benefit from a bit of extra water in the bag. Water and heat help to convert tough collagen to tender gelatin. In theory, there is more than enough water in the meat itself, but from experience, extra water that isn't bound within the meat seems to help.
Thanks Chris, I'll have to give it a try!
Hi Chris, just wondering if the following will work. If the pork belly was brined this way with the skin on; next, cooked sous vide; then pressed and potioned, lastly pan roasted slowly with skin side down. Will the pork skin come out crispy? Will the skin's crispness be affected by the brining?
Skin will come out very crisp if you can fry it for long enough. To avoid overcooking it, the best bet is freeze the pork belly after portioning—weight the belly down so that the skin freezes flat—then fry the skin in a hot pan until golden and crisp. Vacuum pack and reaheat a portion sous vide for service. Then, searing the skin briefly to refresh the crust before plating. Amazing result.
Thanks very much for the tips
Is the Instacure really needed - for flavor or safety? In Thomas Keller "Under Pressure" he uses 20g curing salt for 1kg of water and a 700g portion of pork belly (also cooks at 180F for 10 hrs. I'm just all confused here & would appreciate any guidance. I also have a "natural" curing mix Whole Foods gave me (from Bill Baron's Specialty Foods) that uses celery juice powders to get the nitrites "naturally" I guess. Think there is any difference in results besides the obvious pink coloring? Since I have controlled environment, I'm leaning to skipping any nitrites, and cooking 36 hrs with an equilibrium brine in the bag. Thanks in advance.
The pink coloring comes from the sodium nitrite, turning into nitric oxide that reacts with myoglobin to make it permanently pink. If you leave the nitrites out entirely (which would mean skipping celery powder, or paprika, or other vegetable powder that contain high concentrations of nitrite) then the flavor is a bit less "porky". With modern refrigeration, safety is much less of an issue.
How long would this keep refrigerated?
Vaccum sealed and stored below 5 °C / 41 °F, you should expect 20 to 30 days with little loss of freshness.
Why remove the skin?I'm new to sous vide and accustomed to cooking with a conventional oven. Normally I'd de-glaze the roasting pan, make a roux and then flavour a sauce. Sous vide obviously doesn't allow this pan made sauce. Does anyone have recommendations for a sauce?
- originally posted by Thomas Miles
I am answering from disqus and having trouble finding which recipe you are referring to. But ,with sous vide cooking you can certainly do exactly as you say you normally do. Sear, deglaze. make sauce while meat cooks or make sauce and cook in bag with meat.
- originally posted by Grant Lee Crilly
Hi Chris,
At the end of the year I am going to by myself a vaccum sealer and water bath. Next week however, I'm hosting a reception for 50 people where I will be serving roasted belly pork with a chineze glaze. Apart from the brining of the meat, could I use a sealed off plastic bag to cook the meat at low temperature or could I simply 'roast' it off in the oven at low temperature or do you have any other suggestions?
Just braise it in a low oven covered tightly over night.
Temperature between 60 and 80?
I was wondering what the salt quantity would be if I wanted a 24 hour brine? Would you double the salt and keep everything else the same? Its a matter of walk in space for that amount of time...
Its tricky, if you could cut it thinner to begin with that would be better. But if you strengthen the salt rise then pack and cook the salt will continue to travel into the meat as time goes on. The problem is that the pink salts will likely not have made their way to the interior before the heat does, then you end up with brown meat with a pink ring, sort of weird. Try cutting it thinner or smaller for now.
Thanks Grant. So the issue is the pink salt penetration, not the salted flavor. Got it.
How much can I scale this recipe? 3.5Kg is about 6x what I want to make. But dividing by 6 makes some quantities (e.g. pink salt) so small I worry about errors in measuring the ingredients.
Since it's not an equilibrium brine, can I divide all the brine ingredients (including the water of course) by 4?
Hi Dan, I went 1/2 or 0.5 scale as a home cook, I've just started the sous-vide cooking process I've made subtle changes!! ... (errors if you prefer in my opinion) but will let you know how I get on. i left out the insta cure, not realising the reason why it was needed... and i didn't have any.. The brine smelt good , not powerful and I used weights to ensure it was submerged in the larger container that i had to, ensure full submersion... also the brine/herb mix could have been finer in my opinion but the blender could only do so much (I'm using what I have not professional equipment). I'm also using a cheap home style vacuum sealer, liquid and sous-vide don't mix as I've found with this machine! but got it to work, will give more feedback once my patience and hunger has been satisfied!! ( i'm regretting the not understanding on the use of the cure (instacure...or pink mix) but that is more aesthetic and understand the effect now. will keep you posted
Can the cooked pork belly be frozen? How long would it last in the freezer for if it was properly vacuum sealed and stored?
Hi chris, I curerntly dont have a chamber vacuum sealer i was wondering if there is a way to adapt this recipe to a Foodsaver style sealer or if i should just adjust the cooking time if i seal wihtout water. Thanks
Freezing it is not that helpful. It can become a bit dry afterwards as the ice crystals thaw and water is released. I just keep it vac packed and in the fridge for months. If you dont have a vac machine, then I guess freezing is the best option.
Sure - just freeze the water and then seal in the bag. I've done it with veg stock/veggies, olive oil w/salmon, etc. Works great -
I doubt I can find Insta Cure or similar here in Italy, and I didn't understand from previous comments what it is for. It just helps to have a pinker meat?
is there a video of this? With the french lentils?
Since it stays a long time into water it prevents the meat to get bad. Also if you buy NaN02 and mix it with table salt (6%NAN02 and 94%normla Salt) you will have the curing salt.
Thank you for the answer! With "to get bad" you mean that meat could rot?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sodium_nitrite
If using water displacement method using ziplocs (no vac machine ;-/) how long would it last, @Chris_;Young? Am I good for ten days?
Hows it all going?
Do we put normal water in the sous vide bag or the brine liquid? Thanks for your answer!
Its 6:50 am and I have just chilled the pork, going to taste it. It will be served tomorrow!
i would like to serve the pork with a good crackling.is there any way i can do that with this recipe. should i remove the skin from the belly before cooking sous vide or should i fry the skin side after cooking it sousvide.
would this brine recipe works also for a rack of pork? I should I cook it the same way sous vide? thanks
Due to serious oversight and lack of editing my anova settings, the pork belly was done and the machine turned off about 2 hours before I could ice it after getting up in the morning. I submerged it immediately and am super disappointed in myself since it took so many days to put together. When I pulled it out the bath was at 45C, the pork was double bagged using a food saver and ice cubes.
My mind tells me to chuck it, my heart is in pieces. Thoughts?
On storing after cooking. I have been told that once you brine + cook the pork you can actually keep it for weeks (48 days). Is that correct? On clarification, could one open the bag after cooking and still keep it for weeks or does the bag, which I assume have been completely serialized after 18h of cooking helps with the preservation and hence 48 days does not apply anymore?
Hi there,
I have been following your recipes for some time now and they are really great! Thanks a lot. You guys are doing an excellent job, truly an inspiration to modern gastronomy. I also find your website and the way you publish your recipes very unique and beautiful.
For this recipe I was wondering if I could split the cooking time, considering that I use a steamer instead of the immersion circulator. I don't think its very safe if my steamer is functioning for such a long period.
Thank you.
Hey Joaquin, There is a big difference between NO2 (nitrite) and NO3(Nitrate), the formula for Instacure #1 is as follows:
¨A standard product used for wet-curing. It is 93.75 percent table salt and 6.25 percent sodium nitrite, along with a pink dye to make sure nobody sprinkles it on their soup by mistake. (See also Prague Powder No. 1)¨ and that definition is from Chef Steps.
This is one of the most ignorant things I have ever heard.
Can anyone explain why they add water to the vac-bag, when sous viding the pork? I haven;t heard of this being used before.
It is just to create enough liquid to create a sauce afterwards, or does it play a role in keeping the pork moist (even though its already brined). Thanks
Hello Community, have you tried using a blast chiller to freeze portioned pieces? Where should I look for HACCP plan advice?
The picture of the belly looks like as it was pressed to achieve the uniform shape, was that the case or how else do achieve the uniform shape?
hi! for how long can I keep it refrigirated ?
Same question here! Once it's cooked sous-vide, how many days/weeks can we keep it in the fridge?
Once cooked sous vide, Grant mentioned in the comments "I just keep it vac packed and in the fridge for months."
Wtf... this recipe completely changed mid brine. The old one said brine for 96 hrs and cook for 16 now it says brine for 48 hrs and cook for 36!!!@ Which is it!!! No updated date on the recipe!!
Where the hell does the duck fat come into the picture???
Its a famous restaurant.
haha
I was just messin' around. Very familiar with Heston Blumenthal.
It’s pressed.
Hi, the belly is in brine, i dont used the inst cure, is it okay anyway?
Hello everyone, Can we use the brine liquid more than once?
😂😂😂👌
I have used this recipe in formal dinner parties. It worked beautifully.
Instead of wet brine can we use a dry brine brine and add a certain amount of baking soda (or anything to rise the ph) to make the skin extra crispy( like some Chinese recipe ) and maybe help some proteins to break down to make the meat even tender . If yes how much ?
This is something we recently experimented with and had some pretty poor results. The traditional Chinese recipes have a focus on drying the skin out as you cook it, reducing the moisture much like the process of chicharrones. But when we Sous Vide we are not reducing moisture at all and we were never able to achieve that puff and crackle we were looking for. If you stumble over a way that works please share it with us!
Thank you for answer
If you boil it and readjust the salinity, then yes.
its end up to salty.... i tried to decrease the time is still salty... what is the risk if we brine the pork in shorter time?? i plan to brine only for 12 hours,, is it okey???
I would recommend cutting the salt content by 10% and keep the same brining time if it is too salty for you.
What is happen if we cutting the time? Any certain reason why we need brining for long time? And also cooking in waterbath for long time..
If you want to cut the time you will need to increase the cooking temperature. Say 165°F for 12-18 hours. The low and slow is what makes the recipe fantastic and texturally perfect. Raise the temperature and you will create firm more hammy flavor and textures. You can brine for as little or long as you wish. Its all about equalizing the brine throughout the meat all the way to the center. Less time in brine will result in un equal salinity in the meat. You will achieve good results even if you brine less with a longer cook, but I would brine the lotted time if you want to shorten the cook and raise the temperature.
Same. Try this: https://www.chefsteps.com/activities/braised-pork-belly?fbclid=IwAR1S6BVCSMllr2DqBNVvT1SktriB30JaX6UYBHGt1gdlxeJIRaf9CVBMmCY
