Go to the Article: Fish time / temps
Jump in to let me know what you like and what you dont. Do the photos suck? DO you not care? Need more videos?
I don't think any of the above quality is bad at all. Is it a bit different than your usual high quality stuff, yes, but is it more than enough for me to learn from? I just took away a ton of information.
I think in this case, quantity is more important than quality (in terms of video and photograph, NOT content). I'm not sure how everyone else will react, but how anyone could complain about the above stuff would confuse me.
Side note: more butchering videos would be AWESOME. I butchered a hare this weekend and just sorta went with it. It went well, but a ChefSteps video would have been awesome (even if it was an iPhone video!).
Also, that turbot video, damn. I've wanted that forever. I actually have a source for Turbot, but have always been hesitant because of butchering it (and the price sometimes...). That said, could you upload a SLOWER version of that video again or include it in the sous vide course? Just a little too fast. When I did the chicken roulade I prepared it along with the video. It was perfect.
Anyway, we'll see what others things, but quantity over quality in some cases could be great.
What do you think?
p.s. saw that you said the video of cutting the Salmon was MORE work than normal. I'm torn here as I like the video, but I also find the pictures and explanations of the tuna and turbot useful as well. I guess if that salmon video never existed I wouldn't have missed it? But now that I saw it, it isn't terrible? But if that means less content being put out or larger periods between content being put out, I'm not sure it is worth it.
Keep it coming. Any and all info is great! Obviously the higher the quality the better. I personally don't like when you put little videos in the margins. I much prefer when they are in the main section of the page. I know you use them like footnotes, but my eyes always glaze right past them.
Chefsteps is outstanding. Not because there is so much content, but because you aim for perfection. IMO oppinion you should stick to that concept. Modernist cuisine was a big success. Do you think, a book with the same text but with mediocre pictures could have been that sucessful?
Please, keep doing this! I don't care about the videos/photos quality if it means more information.
Of course your videos are all masterpieces but I agree with Robert, down here: in this case, quantity is more important than quality.
Keep hiting us with fresh stuff, no matter how the photos suck!
Thanks again, CS!
I actually found the pictures with descriptions to be sufficiently useful when compared to the video. I would say that ChefSteps most valuable ways of teaching and serving the community are in the explanations of why you do things a certain way, and exemplifying the technique. Perhaps a discussion about why a certain type of fish might react differently at different doneness temperatures when compared to others would be very helpful. That way, if I find myself with an unfamiliar piece of fish, but with a thermometer, I would be able to do well to aim for and predict my desired result.
I think everything you do is awesome!! Below is my critique.
First Video: Different temps of cooked salmon
It gives me intuition on the temperatures of salmon on how the texture/look changes at different temperatures. It would be great if you measured also in Fahrenheit. I'm in the USA.
Second Video: Cutting the salmon
pretty awesome. I love the step by step review when breakdown the salmon. Very clear to follow.
Photos:
Least favorite of mine. Take away the table, and notes and I would be hard pressed to distinguish between the varying temps.
Being used to the CS high quality photography…, yes the pictures do suck and lack in the
right lightning and brightness. Red snapper…, too much brightness, Black Cod and Turbot much
the same, May if you take the pictures with the light, say from the other side
of the table or sideways would work better to make a visual distinction of
different temperature results. Sideway visualization could explain better the doneness
of the cut than taking the pic from a top down surface.
Any other, I think it’s a great and helpful task to experiment with different temperatures on
fish, adding a cut of raw fish for visual comparison and explain in written
texture and density of the fish meat which influences temperature and cooking duration
would be the cream on top.
The video is outsanding as ever!! Compromising on quality over quantity isn't someting what I would suggest.
So, generally, this kind of thing is absolutely great to have - not just reference tables like this, but just reports on whatever is going on in the kitchen. Just like the development logs for the recipes, this is the kind of content that helps me learn how to think like you guys do, rather than just cooking like you do. And when this stuff includes info about the things that don't work, it's super helpful because it helps me do post-mortems on my own stuff when it goes wrong.
Video versus photo is mostly an information-content thing for me; I can tell much more about the texture of the fish from the video than I can from the photos. That said, the video is not so easy to manipulate. The hybrid approach you used in the Egg Calculator - where you've got short videos showing the way the egg flows when broken, but at discrete points on a slider that I could scrub back and forth - that's an approach that has legs, I think.
Also, have you considered animated GIFs?
The photos in this case are particularly bad, I think, because there's really not a lot to learn from them - the Ahi Tuna one is OK but the rest I can't really see much of a difference between the pieces, so they seem pointless. The text descriptions are really all about the way the fish flakes, so it would make more sense to get closeups of how they look with a fork pushed through them, similar to the video but just an 'after' pic instead of a full video. Aesthetically it might not look as nice as the white-backdropped shiny surface you have in the video but I'll take useful over pretty any day.
That's an interesting comment about the aside (that's what we call them) videos Michael. I wouldn't have thought of it. Thanks.
Hi, thanks for ask our feedback .
Not much to say about videos and pictures, are simply the best . I really appreciate the last seconds of the videos when you can see the texture and how they are resistant to the cut by a fork. And really appreciate a few words , more than "mmm so good" about the taste of the meals.
We can see every ingredient you use and in my opinion i want to know why you choose them. My point is i would love CS dedicate videos and pictures to their raw material . Would be nice a Shopping day video , That could be very encouraging for all of us. to see why and which products you choose in a supermarket / market which anyone could access too.
cheers mates
It was really usefull... I did the salmon and the tuna at 45º here in Brazil for my clients on an event and everybody loved it, thank you guys.
This is really useful. I really like the photos because it makes it easy to compare the different temperatures. The video helped clarify the texture. The tables with texture description and commentary is very useful. I am sure I will be referring back to this very frequently whenever I cook any of these fish. The photo quality did not deter in my opinion.
Thank you!
For information like this I think I get more from photos than videos. I watched the video several times pausing to analyse at different stages. If the photos were just taken the same orientation and zoom to the footage, with one before and one after cutting/forking side by side and the notes under each, maybe the grid/comparison photo at the beginning, that would be my ideal setup. I did not find the quality of the photos was a hinderance to me discovering/learning about the effects of temperature on different fish.
More content would be amazing, tackling the reason why something is happening when we cook interests me the most, but as others have mentioned just info on what you're developing what you enjoy cooking and ingredients you are using is also something I would enjoy. I guess content like this could be presented as you have done here, a post on the forum, with links or photos. The other content like courses and premium content could be on the website. I just enjoy any content presented as I can be confident that the information I am receiving is coming from a reliable source (highly trained and experienced people) and often has been tested and proven over years of observation and interaction with others.
I do think the aesthetic, visual appeal and style of your content and website in general, is a major factor in what makes it special. However, for me at least, words and data convey information very effectively and if less video content and very high quality images = more expert advice, opinion and information, I think that would = me cooking much smarter.
A question for the chefsteps team. What would your ideal chefsteps look like? What do you enjoy creating and sharing with us? What content excites you?
When people are passionate and proud of what they do it shows I think.
P.S Your passion definitely shows I am just really interested as to what your ultimate ideal setup would be.
Please continue to take the same care with your web/video quality that you do with your food. Ignore those who say quantity is more important than quality. You don't take that approach to food, right? Current followers may want you to go in many directions that suit their interests. Your interest, presumably, as a business is in reaching more people. You will only continue to "wow" the new people if you continue with the incredible quality you have shown to date.
I think the pictures are excellent! They get across the information that needs to be communicated and they punctuate the written information perfectly. I don't need a studio photo for my purposes and I'd rather have 5 photos like this over 1 studio photo. Why? well what do I use the photos for? usually an indication of what to expect BUT more than that: an idea of how things are going along the way (say mid recipe) and if they have in fact gone wrong! i.e: "I feel like I've followed the recipe exactly but my results are clearly different to the photo" I've always found plenty of photos of the cooking process to be immensely useful when attempting recipes.
To me, the technical 'quality' of the photographs is not a big deal. It is to me with say the 'Modernist Cuisine' book because I can put that on a coffee table and show people interesting and stunning pictures. However I've never found myself saying: "Hey go check out the good photography on this website" it's just not the same as print. I come to this site for: a) The dense and thoroughly tested information and recipes, b) interaction with the authors and c) recipes and techniques that challenge me.
Keep up the good work. Whatever new direction you choose, no doubt I'll enjoy it
Photo's/ Video's, great quality or not. It's nice to know where you guys ( and girls) are playing with and keep the discussions going. Than you get a kitchen staff of a gazilion :-) and we get all that nice information.
Great stuff your doing . Thanks!
If you ask me its even more usefull than complex videos. It's encouraging to use this knowledge in making own complex dish in stead of copying yours ideas, and than split it on elements to use it somewhere else. such videos would make my education in modernist cuisine way faster and highly detailed on elements you post in stead on full dishes which i hardly remember in details. Hope you know what i mean, my english is awfull
One of my favorite things at chefSteps are the spectacular videos. They are a trade mark of your brand. If it is a lot of work and hinder more content then limit them to special creations. You could use them for your molecular gastronomy recipes, but please don't get rid of them. I love the video and then the written breakdown. For some reason I retain it more when I comprehend the two together.The pictures were ok, but video you get more of a 3 dimensional aspect. I did not appreciate the fast you tube video of the breakdown of the turbot, It was pointless.
I am concerned with the idea of posting information in the forum. I find it to be overwhelming and difficult to find to reread an article. I prefer the picture catalog you have now. It is easy to find and use.
I am always so amazed at the details and the feed back you want from us. Thank you for letting us be involved.
I like the “suggestions for each area of the fish.”
I liked the salmon temperature chart. I liked that you told us your favorite. It would be OK to also say “43 was our favorite for this application, 48 was our favorite for that application.”
the snapper pictures don’t tell me much. Same with the cod pix. I don’t know what I’m looking for.
The salmon video fixes some of this because you can watch the fish move, but there’s a cognitive record-scratch between some of the shots - as if you cut/replaced the piece of fish in between the “labeled” beauty shot and the “demo” fork/knife shot. I lost track and got confused.
Balancing “well-done is for suckers” and “personal preference is personal”
I liked that you labeled a “second favorite” temperature. My sweety prefers well-done food and I don’t judge. I know doneness preferences are relative, but I still want to know what you consider the “best” temp and the “range of pretty good temps, because if my basic skills instructor comes to my house for dinner, I want to “get it right.” Similarly, “overcooked” is a useful word IF explained.
Black cod temperature list: “not flaky in any way.” do you like that, dislike that, or is it application-dependent?
I suppose my overall suggestion is: I want you to pretend I know very little, and then aim toward “advanced” haute cuisine anyway.
"Black cod temperature list: “not flaky in any way.” do you like that, dislike that, or is it application-dependent?"
"I suppose my overall suggestion is: I want you to pretend I know very little, and then aim toward “advanced” haute cuisine anyway."
+1 for both these points.
I'm not gonna mind mini-update iPhone-quality photos as long as they teach me, and these particular photos do not. (That said, I'm not willing to give up the gorgeous photos on the big-presentation output, and that seems to be a big factor in CS' "buzz," which I'm sure you already know.)
As a quick and dirty ongoing development log, I can live with the quality. As part of a free/paid course the photoes are not going to work.
It would be nice to have the temp/time/texture tables as an infographic that can be printed out as quick reference rather than have to dive into a recipe/blog section to confirm a temp for a fish I cook five times a year.
I find the temperature tables with comments most useful. When you provide both your personal opinion and a descriptive perspective on the texture/feel of the protein it allows us to consider a range of temperatures to consider for individual tastes as well as the likely choice for a dinner party for guest with unknown preferences. Additional input data would be helpful particularly for larger fish; various cuts, thicknesses, (as discussed below). How about fish calculator like the egg calculator?
I really like the break down of temperatures, watching the salmon being cut at each temperature and the visual of all the different temperatures for each fish. I would also like to know if you found any suitable applications for the temperatures that weren't your favorites, and also how you would use your favorites. I guess this would lead to a much larger post every time though, so if speed of getting the information out there is the top priority I understand that more information isn't possible. It's great to see what else you guys are up too!
While the HD videos are beautiful, I want the knowledge. I'm cool with this quality of pictures and videos.
http://www.cookingissues.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/02/salmontemperatures.jpg
The video of cutting into the different temperatures of salmon is pretty, but it doesn't tell me much. Seeing the different results is informative in itself, but commentary about what we're seeing is important too. Mashing a piece with the edge of the knife, sliding the knife down toward the board and away from the fish might serve to illustrate the different textures better; otherwise, 40 and 45C look very similar in texture from the way they cut. Kind of like demonstrating the texture of a puree with a spoon.
Just as presentation is a major part any good dish, so it is a part of education and passion, if your presentation i sloppy you lose the focus of your audience, as such I'm very inclined to say that your high quality video's and highly polished show cases are those that really keep the attention of the watchers, those are in my opinion great for you tube and main course content.
How ever you could use some additional less polished video's and pictures for appendix sections in most courses where you show quick how to's or FAQ answers for the course.
That will enforce the high quality and perfection in the course main material but allow for additional elaboration and illustration for critical points found through user feedback.
/M
With regards to the salmon video I don't really see much benefit to the "Ready for serve shot" followed by pure sousvide piece cut. Either cut the ready for service piece or don't bother showing it, as your searing (whether with Torch, Grill or Pan) has a rather decisive impact on the flavor, texture and cut of the piece.
Or better yet show both cut
I do like the photos and I think they are pretty instructive, except for those of the Turbot, which very similar.
I would say, make an own class for this, a video on each fish you want to use and detail (showing the texture of what temperature like in the salmon vid but also time could be nice). Temperature and slip in a link to the butchery of each fish so people who don't know how to break it down can learn. The more information we get the more we would like to enroll.
