nav[aria-label="Primary Navigation"] { padding: 0; & ul { list-style: none; width: 100%; display: flex; flex-direction: row; justify-content: start; align-items: start; gap: 30px; padding: 0; & li { margin: 0; } & ul li { list-style: none; } } }

Sansaire kickstarter - immersion circulator for $200

richard.fine

http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/seattlefoodgeek/sansaire-sous-vide-circulator-for-199

Thought some people here might be interested (didn't see a topic already). I like how it looks like a pint of guinness

Find more posts tagged with

Everything Else

Comments

aaron.murphycrews

Just got the replacement unit this afternoon- glad to be back in business!

I've been using the Sansaire w a 5 gallon tank and have done several long cooks. I'm getting the same temp consistency as @C_wiz: +/- 0.1ºC at mid-range temps for proteins, perhaps only slightly more variable at high temps and no lid on the tank (+/- 0.2ish based on the few times I have cooked high temp). The larger tank does take some time to heat up, so I will often start with hot tap water, which reaches 50-70ºC target temps in less than 10 minutes.

@C_Wiz- I usually clip it to the side of a 5 gallon bath and always remove it when it's not in use (not sure if this is important or not, but seemed prudent). How about you? I agree on the plastic backing, it doesn't fit perfectly, and overall the plastic build quality has a consumer-product feel. I had the same initial impression about the cover being longer than the unit at the bottom. I think it's intentional to allow water intake.

@Aldoogie- Good call on the Sur la Table route- they have a great return policy and you wouldn't have to wait for shipping if yours died before an important dinner (had to abort a SV brisket planned for passover).

Even with the minor set-back, I'm still a huge fan of the Sansaire. I can see getting a second in the near future unless something happens to this one.

Jack_Mayer_85396

I agree, I got one of the first Kickstarter units and it has performed flawlessly thus far. I haven't used it for long cooks yet (PolyScience unit for that), but if I have a long cook going in the PS circulator, it's great to have for some fish, chicken or steak ... I'm very happy with mine.

funkspieler_57683

I got one of the first batch of Sansaire units about two months ago and it's been a great second unit to my Polyscience. Very convenient due to its size. No issues with performance, but I do clip it to a smaller container than the large tub my Polyscience heats. Very nice to have a second when doing tasting menus.

cwizou

Thanks @AMC for that very interesting feedback.

I also got mine and so far I've been impressed by the accuracy compared to my "old" Sous Vide Magic (1500D with FMM). Since I didn't have a circulator on the SVM, the temperatures seemed to fluctuate a lot more, +/- 0.3C. Another issue I had with the SVM was the temperature probe failing despite removing it from the water bath when not used, I had 3 failing so far with weekly/bi-weekly usage over a couple years, not too bad but annoying. It's way to early to see how the Sansaire will fare on that specific point, but hopefully better.

So, the Sansaire so far is much more accurate +/- 0.1C throughout cooking on the same recipient which is pretty good. It does feel a good bit slower to heat overall compared to the SVM/FMM (rated 1500/2000W at 220V) but maybe it's in my head and I'm getting faster at prep.

The one big issue so far that I have with the Sansaire is the back cover that very poorly fits. It just feels like it barely hangs in there, it's not properly aligned to the rest of the unit and definitely feels "wrong". It's not a show stopper but it's something they can definitely improve on. They mentionned on kickstarter that they had to push back the delivery because on the very first units if fit too snugly. This time it's definitely way too loose and doesn't feel right. One can consider it a non issue since it doesn't impact the performance/usage of the Sansaire but still it feels cheap.

We'll have to see how it goes in the long run, hopefully the motor issue isn't too prevalent.

Question for @AMC, did you leave it submerged when not used ?

Alex_36374

converted to this form the Sous Vide Supreme. What I like is that the water circulates. Got a 22 gallon bucket from a restaurant supply store, this thing works like a charm. Could not be happier. Got it from Surla Table; 1 year return policy. Feeling good about the purchase thus far.

aaron.murphycrews

Got mine in late February and loved it (like, really loved it) for about 6 weeks. Last week the motor started smoking and burned out. I was using it almost daily, including a few 72 hour cooks.

On the upside, I was super impressed with customer service- especially for a kickstarter project. They responded to my email within an hour and shipped out a replacement unit within 24 hours. Hopefully this one survives.

Anyone else have similar issues since getting theirs?

Jack_Mayer_85396

I expect to see mine next week sometime ...

richard.fine

The first few units have apparently arrived with customers, so I guess they sorted whatever issues they had.

Mine's due in a couple of weeks, looking forward to it...

ren_74229

IANAL, an engineer, or anything else that qualifies me to be an expert any anything! but after reading the patent, to me, it reads like the patent is for the housing of the immersion circulator plus for a particular impeller design that makes the housing work.

In particular, the patent says that that the leap in "the art" is the change from a 'box of electronics on top of exposed submerged bits (circulator, heater, temp) which are usually covered by a *separate* metal cage to protect them as well as protect whatever you're cooking' to a 'two-piece single sandwich housing'. I'm translating and simplifying here of course...

Again, I'm not a patent expert or engineer, but comparing most of the newer consumer level circulators...it seems as though sansaire is the only one that appears designed in this manner. The nomiku and anova circs while looking "one-piece"ish, appear to still use the "box of electronics on top of submerged bits coved by metal" design.

seijoed

I actually think the IP is around the impeller and the vortex created for stable circulation, all older system were closed loop or open loop pump systems. It also was the point of most contention for DIY people.

prince_of_porcelain

It will be interesting to watch this one develop. They generated a huge amount of cash via kickstarter, and I'd hate to see the crowd source community take it on the chin because they didn't do their IP investigation up front. That's north of 4000 people that ordered the circulator at $200 each. If the project falls through, I would guess that they could lose out. That's not to fault Polyscience. They should absolutely be able to defend their patents, and although circulators have been around for a while, I think that the chef series that came out in 2010 (or so) was a big jump in moving from repurposed lab equipment to a true kitchen appliance and it doesn't surprise me that there is IP around that shift. I just think it would be unfortunate for the cost to fall on the shoulders of the community.

Brandon_34695

Oh, the connection between Sansaire and Myhrvold is no mystery. Scott Heimendinger can be found in the Modernist Cuisine books credited as "Business development manager."

He mentions launching the project as an independent venture, but again no big surprise if he had help under the umbrella of Intellectual Ventures. Ironically, (or maybe not), many journalists have suggested that IV is a monster in the patent litigation realm, filling hundreds of cases via shell companies. It is hard to trace those connections, and the largest Lodsys has denied any connection, as suggested by This American Life. I don't think anyone has hard evidence, but it is a persistent topic in tech news. *

It would be kind of sad if Scott was caught in the middle of someone trying to make a point about IV (they don't appear to have sued anyone else with a stick looking circulator).

Scott appears representing Modernist Cuisine in many places, including.

http://www.chow.com/videos/show/mdrn-ktchn#!/show/mdrn-ktchn/128422/wtf-is-modernist-cusine

http://techcrunch.com/2013/12/05/google-backed-anti-patent-troll-bill-passes-the-house/

http://thehill.com/blogs/hillicon-valley/technology/329611-accused-patent-troll-intellectual-ventures-ramps-up-lobbying

DiggingDogFarm_65362

From the Sansaire website......

"Is this project related to Modernist Cuisine?

Nope. Although Scott works for Modernist Cuisine, this project was underway before he joined the team. He was generously given permission to continue work on the Sansaire as an after-hours project."

matthew.snyder77

That's just the abstract; the actual patent is over 4,400 words long and is very detailed.

Been reading up on this, and it seems that the person behind the Sansaire is connected to a company called Intellectual Ventures..... which was founded by Nathan Myhrvold. Can't quite determine if Sansaire received venture funding from IV (in addition or perhaps as part of the highly successful Kickstarter campaign), or if the person behind the circulator was merely an ex-employee or something. The innernets can be vague sometimes.

IV has quite the reputation of being a patent troll, meaning they buy up existing patents and instead of using them as the basis for developing improvements, they simply run around finding companies that may (or may not, as is most often the case) be infringing the patents and file lawsuits against them in the hopes of collecting license fees. The goal is that the company will decide litigation costs will exceed the lifetime cost of the license, and they will pay up, even if they are not in fact actually infringing any patents.

But that's a side issue that does not appear to be relevant to the case. Just an interesting observation/connection.

Brandon_34695

"An constant temperature circulator for maintaining a liquid at a constant temperature including a housing that encapsulates a controller, a display, a heating element, a temperature sensor, and an electric motor having an impeller. The housing includes a first port and a second port that cooperatively define a chamber that encapsulates the impeller, an aperture and an opening, such that actuation of the impeller when the electric motor is activated by the controller moves the liquid from the aperture, through the chamber and to the opening."

This was filed in 2010, there's got to be some prior art by someone other than Polyscience. It sounds like a bad patent to me, but hey, they usually do.

DiggingDogFarm_65362

I don't know...I can't imagine that they wouldn't have looked into patents and trademarks as well as "professional" advice before launch...that's just common sense.

Anyway...I feel bad for them...those kinds of lawsuits destroy people...win or lose, it takes everything out of you and then some!

I wish them lots of luck!

Brendan_Lee_56950

I find it hard to believe that at no point did they see those patents. They had to have been reverse engineering the polyscience units when they were designing, i guess it didn't occur to them to see if it was patented. Seems very bush league to me, kickstarter kind of breeds that though I suppose.

DiggingDogFarm_65362

Yep, it appears things are going to get very ugly.

Brendan_Lee_56950

Looks like the Sansaire folks didn't do their homework and are getting sued by Polyscience for patent infringement. I am guessing there will be pretty substantial delays on this thing now.

http://www.scribd.com/doc/187917748/Preston-Industries-v-Modernchef

tuckatodd

Looks kind of cheap to me compared to what else is out there!

prince_of_porcelain

@Brandon_ I've only seen the kickstarter page, and don't have any firsthand knowledge of the device. Bath size is fixed and small (9L), and appears the space for product is only a fraction of that due to the basket. Also doesn't appear to circulate. I think there are better options out there. A lower price may encourage more people to jump in, but I can see getting frustrated by the limitations pretty quickly.

Brandon_34695

It takes up half my countertop and there's only enough room inside for 1 steak?

I'm not sold on this one.

prince_of_porcelain

Yet another Sous Vide Kickstarter: http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/193384747/aquachef-clarity-sous-vide-cooking-made-simple

robert.c.brown15

Should have just bought an Anova for the same price as a sansaire and no worries about whether it will ever ship. But I'm sure sansaire will ship so be sure to let us know how it is!

Rich_McDonough_67546

I backed the Sansaire Kickstarter. But then I also backed the Nomiku on Kickstarter more than a year ago and still waiting *sigh*... Let's hope that circulators are like buses. None for ages and then two come at once ;-)

lfmichaud

I recently ordered the Sansaire unit as a backup unit the last time I thought I had problem with my circulator. Four of my friends also bought it as a first or second unit. I didn't knew about the Anova at the time so it simplified my decision because both units looks very comparables.

matthew.snyder77

No, but if you are looking at the PolyScience stuff you now might have credible options for getting 2 or 3 units instead of 1. And circulators are kind of like puppies; if you get one, you might as well get two.

Brendan_Lee_56950

i don't think they care. If you are looking in this price range its not likely you are going to splurge on the polyscience model.

robert.c.brown15

ahhh. I did not realize that as I am pretty new to what chefsteps is all about. they can delete my posts if they like, just trying to help out budget conscience home cooks but definitely understand how it could be viewed as inappropriate.

matthew.snyder77

I think the ChefSteps crew have been very..... patient with this thread so far, considering PolyScience is effectively a sponsor of the sous vide course and their products are sold through the ChefSteps store.

I dunno, not really my place to weigh in I guess.